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Author
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Topic: Down wind coyotes
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted May 28, 2006 07:02 PM
Actually, maybe I can come up with a better explanation. Or simpler anyway.
When you have to look a man in the eye, and tell him that you probably just cost him and his family several thousand dollars because you just made a poor set up or a poor shot, or whatever the case....
That is when it will hit home, and you will really realize what ADC work amounts to and how people actually rely on you to make the correct decisions in everything that you are trying to do for them.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 28, 2006 07:10 PM
Cal,
Can't disagree with a thing you said. Appreciate and fully understand your input, and clarification of what ADC is, versus recreational calling. I'm forthright in telling people that I'm a recreational caller, not an ADC man. I'll come out if I have time, do what I can and if I'm lucky enough to kill the offending animal. Super! If not, I made no guarantees. They're pretty cool with that, too. We don't have government-paid ADC people in Kansas. One guy at Kansas State does it all and he's appreciative as hell when I, or someone else, saves him a long drive.
Now, if I was ADC, and I was getting paid to do that work, and that work is what I did for my 40 a week, then yeah, I'd do what I needed to do to make sure I did the job right. But, I have a full-time job that needs my undivided attention, a family that expects the same, a shop full of deer capes waiting for at least part of my attention, an estate to work my way through as we settle family business, call orders to fill, vacation with the family in less than two weeks... the list goes on but you get the point. I offer to do what I can and what time and my schedule will allow, and they know that their problem - often caused by themselves when they inadvertently create opportunities for coyotes to do as coyotes do, then call it a "coyote problem" - are not often put at the top of my list of priorities. Again, I do it for the opportunity to keep my skills sharp, and make no guarantee as far as outcomes or results.
So, feel free to pick away. You're talking apples and I consider myself to be a lowly orange. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
As far as Krusty, yep, I've been nice. Still plan to be nice. Ain't nothing changed here. But those are bold words from a man who, at best, can only claim to have shot AT coyotes. Consider the source considered. Won't mention the irony of him attempting to ally himself with Quinton to take a dig at me. Then again, I just did. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 28, 2006 07:29 PM
Cal,
You were typing your second entry the same time as I was, so I missed it.
Yours is a different world than down here. You have ranchers and large-scale livestock producers that enjoy the expertise of a professional Animal Damage Control / Depredation man, and they're lucky to have that. No such critter exists within three hundred miles of me, except for one guy - Charles Lee. He's the only guy in a small office at Kansas State University working thru the K-State Extension Service. He's the one poor soul that gets the calls when good coyotes have gone bad. Unfortunately, he also has to handle everything from nuisance squirrels, starlings, bats, flying squirrels, rough fish, uninformed urbanites, etc., etc.. He depends upon the generosity of Kansas trappers and hunters to help him do his job when one of us is willing to step out and handle a coyote or whatever in his place when the drive is long. His predecessor, F. Robert "Bob" Henderson once told me he had to drive 6 hours to extreme SW Kansas to train a farmer on how to catch a problem coyote. The next day, he had to drive clear back there to teach one of his neighbors the same thing because their calls came in separately.
Your ranchers deal in big dollars and expect to pay a certain amount taxes or fees to cover the expenses of a gov't trapper/ hunter. Around here, these guys won't pay shit for services. They expect it from you or don't want it at all if it costs them so much as a dime. Never mind $3 a gallon gas and 70 mile round trips to their place. If you offer them a reasonable price (and that $50 a coyote until you solve the problem is WAY over their laugh limit), they'll show you the end of the driveway and just endure the problem until they either run out of livestock or the coyote dies of old age.. I have yet to see a single farmer or livestock producer around here, in nearly 30 years, agree to paying so much as a penny to get me to fix their problem. They'll take the loss first and they fully understand those consequences. Therefore, whether or not I'm immediately successful or not is irrelevant. If there was money on the barrel, that'd be one thing. This is another entirely. I make my best effort in exchange for trespass rights. So far, I've been lucky. Admit that. In the past, I've had times when I couldn't make the kill, but I've never had ground pulled away on me for that. In this day of leasing and locked gates, they pretty much have me over the barrel as well since that coffee shop talk cuts both ways. On one hand, they can spread my name via word of mouth, and that benefits me a great deal. On the other, they can let it be known that I can't do shit to fix their problem and that might (but has never) hurt me (yet) They appreciate the effort because I'm the only option they have. I am fully aware and certainly appreciate the problem that guys "like me" cause for guys "like you". This pack I got three out of this week have been a pain in the ass for me for two years because of noobs trying their hands on them every weekend of the fall and winter. I even enlisted dog wagons on them this winter when we couldn't make anything happen. They didn't see a single coyote in those sections, yet here they are - same place they've been for three years. Somehow, we've gotten lucky and intercepted a few this week. To those guys, the fact that we killed the one within eyesight of his back step makes him pretty happy, and that's all the ching I need outta this deal. No ADC men around these parts to get their toes stepped on, so no harm, no foul. Now, if y'all want to come down and help 'em out, I'll be glad to give them your number.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted May 28, 2006 08:23 PM
Greenside,
I definitely have the confidence.
Good Hunting Chad
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted May 29, 2006 12:23 AM
Lance,
I was actually "helping" Q tease Matt, in a nice way... just playing along, and around.
(*and for sure didn't think I'd need protection for it? ![[Frown]](frown.gif) Sheesh)
Personally, I thought it was a durn good joke (not even close to a serious dig).
And it went well with one of Q's best zingers, of all time, maybe THE best.
"Exactly how many is "countless"..." 
I dunno why the amount of coyotes I have shot (shot at, or hit, or found after I hit, or whatever ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif) ), and my going along with how humorously ironic Matt's own bold use of the word "countless", are related?
Ya know what else is ironic? After I posted, I was thinking that I should have mentioned how nice it must be for Matt to have a pretty good teacher himself, and how maybe that could lead him to feel like he's had "countless" successes? It must have really helped him on, his learning curve.
He's a lucky kid, to have you for a friend.
Better late than never.
Krusty 
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Andy L
HI, I'M THE NEW MODERATOR OF THE CENTRAL MISSOURI FORUM, PULL MY FINGER!
Member # 642
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posted May 29, 2006 04:01 AM
Lance, I think you got alot of the same thing going on as we do in this area. There are alot of ranchers that have perceived coyote problems. Most dont have a problem, but if they have a dead calf and see a coyote in the same day, they have a problem.
Heres an example. Im not going into detail, Im tired of telling it on here and other boards. But, an old farmer I hunt on alot, or used to, calls nearly every spring about a calf killer. Every year it sure looks to me like a still born that a coyote ate on. If I can produce a dead coyote, yearling bitch or whatever, hes happy as hell.
He also happens to be a big supporter of the road huntin, hound runners. I guess I had been neglecting my work for him, , since I didnt hunt much last year due to my real job, and he got them out there. One got a ticket for shooting off the road. (hadnt heard about that ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ) He had the nerve to go to the Dept of Conservation and bitch. Saying that these boys were doing good on problem coyotes and shouldnt be held to the law of not shooting off the road. They offered to send a trapper out to survey the situation and take care of any problem coyotes. He declined, saying they might catch a dog. I just heard from him about all of this friday.
I wrote all of this just to make a point. This guy is typical of most ranchers around here, and I suspect typical of alot everywhere. Every dead calf that has been chewed on was killed by a coyote. Every coyote is a calf killer. Thats how they see it. When a logical option is offered, he refused.
I will go kill the occaisional springtime/summertime coyote for a rancher like this guy. But I dont like to. IMO, its not as much ADC work, but more like babysitting a rancher that has no idea whats actually going on to insure I got more land to hunt on next winter.
Thats more of what it is than ADC work.
[ May 29, 2006, 04:05 AM: Message edited by: Andy L ]
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Andy
Posts: 2645 | From: Central Missouri | Registered: Apr 2005
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 06:54 AM
In Kansas, years ago, Bob Henderson started what he called the Animal Damage Control Cooperative Program where he had a list of trappers/ callers from every county in the state. We each underwent some training, mostly about liabilities, and if he got a call, we did, too. Bob's program was one of the most successful in the country, but it had its limitations.
The main method we used for handling a complaint was to work with the producer to evaluate his operational methods. In most cases, the producer was doing something (or not doing something) to create an opportunity for a coyote to do what it was doing that conflicted with the producer's interests. Oftentimes, simply changing the producer's way of doing things was sufficient to eliminate the problem. For example, I've had guys that leave their sheep out all night along big riverbends. Now, I'd never do that in, say, Texas or Arizona knowing full well that they'd be at the mercy of high school boys and middle age "artistic" sorts, but all we have here to worry about are the coyotes. Anyway, he was losing a lamb a night. Upon evaluation of the situation, I found that he had a carcass dump (mostly cattle) on the side of his farm opposite from the river. Therefore, my first recommendation, in accordance with our way of doing ADC work here, was to recommend that the producer do two things: eliminate the carcass pile and find an alternative means of disposing of his dead livestock (we have a large rendering company twenty-five miles away that send a big truck out for free), shed the sheep at night, and enlist a nearby guy that raises alpacas to maybe let him pasture a few at his place with the sheep. Maybe get a Pyrenee raised for sheep work. Under our SOP's that would suffice to keep the bosses at K-State happy, and often was the extent of managing that particular problem. I disagreed and always made/ make an effort to take control measures one step further. Because I see the issue as two parts needing a two-pronged approach.
In my opinion, the producer has two actual problems to correct: the opportunity for a coyote to cause grief, and the coyote(s) itself. If you only deal with one, the other will eventually rear its ugly head again. Eliminate the problem and that coyote will only find someone else to bother. Eliminate just the coyote and it's only a matter of time before another coyote recognizes the opportunity and you have the sequel.
Eliminate both the opportunity and the offending coyote and you've fixed the problem. Often, I choose to eliminate the coyote first, if at all possible (and yes, the producer may lose one or two lambs in the meantime, and he's aware of that) but only because the opportunity is the coyote's weakness, its Achilles heel, and the opportunity maintains the presence of circumstances that compel the coyote to continue with predictable behavior patterns that I can hopefully exploit.
In those cases where the producer has declined in eliminating the opportunity, the problems persist over generations of coyotes. I've got one guy that's like that - dropping his carcasses in a pit a hundred yards from his corrals. He knows I call him job security and he knows he's his own worst enemy, but still refuses to change his way of doing stuff.
I also know that this method is impractical for a place like WY or the Dakotas where sheep and cattle are on huge pastures and bringing them in every night is non-feasible. But that there is the difference between the world up there, and ours down here. And it also illustrates the fact that I'm not ignorantly stumbling blind around the countryside getting lucky here and again in whacking and stacking every coyote within a six mile radius of some poor farmer that thinks the coyotes have killed all his stillborn calves. The method I employ is one that has been tested over time and proven to be the most effective in Kansas given the circumstances we have here.
Furthermore, in this area I may have six or more different landowners on every section of ground, and ten different habitat types/ plant communities because of crop fields, set aside ground, CRP, creeks and watercourses. There are few places that I can call that I have the luxury of calling out across sagebrush and yucca for as far as the eye can see and where I can set up along whichever edge affords me the perfect wind conditions and direction. It simply doesn't exist here and as such, I've developed a technique that allows me to work around that issue somewhat when necessary.
Andy,
Ticket for shooting at coyotes from the road? LOL Around here, you can shoot them from the road, using a bazooka or whatever you want, anytime you want. There are absolutely no restrictions or limitation to your personal creativity on how you can kill coyotes in Kansas. That rule must be because you're further east, or it's all those damned Democrats.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Greenside
seems to know what he is talking about
Member # 10
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posted May 29, 2006 06:59 AM
Chad
Just curious. When you setup with a coyote to your backside(upwind) and call downwind, what do you think the average distance from you that the coyote would pass (right or left) on it's path downwind? Do they ever stop and glance at you(the source of the sound) or do they just turn their ears in your direction as they pass by?
Dennis
Posts: 719 | From: IA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 07:06 AM
Krusty,
No offense taken here, man. Matt and I had a relatively good year, and more importantly, a good time. Looking over my log sheet from the season, I called 52 coyotes and killed 29 (many were multiples of 2 and as many as 4), 24 coons (killed 20), 3 bobcats (killed one) in 166 total stands resulting in a kill:stands ratio of just better than 1:3. Up in the big country, that might be average or below. Around here, no one else even came close to us. We were blessed to have a good season, and more importantly, enjoy ourselves in the process. Along the way, I managed to put lead in a couple coyotes that had been problems in the past and, in doing so, made a few farmers happy.
So, I guess "countless" is one less than 52. LOL Up there where Q and Cal live, getting to 52 coyotes seen is what we around here call "lunch time". If it will make everyone happy, I'll spend some time with Matt between now and November working on his basic math skills. Okay?
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted May 29, 2006 08:33 AM
Lance, Matt implied that the "countless coyotes" were downwind and "within spittin' distance". Getting a little careless with facts can get a man "run off the porch" as you put it.
But helping to call in 52 coyotes in his first year is one hell of a beginning and you can't take anything away from that.
[ May 29, 2006, 08:44 AM: Message edited by: Rich Higgins ]
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted May 29, 2006 08:42 AM
Andy, my experiences with cattle ranchers in Mo. were different than your's. I visited every rancher that I could and not a single one had ever lost a calf to a coyote. They all told me that the coyotes would hang around when the cows were calving, but they were just waiting for an opportunity for a shot at the afterbirth. Some let me call on their property because the coyotes were hard on their turkeys and whitetail fawns. The goat raisers were a whole 'nuther ballgame.
They all had high enclosures, llamas, donkeys and guard dogs, and they thought the coyotes were ruining them.
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 08:48 AM
Rich, we saw 52, and killed 29. Either way, those are good numbers for this part of Kansas. I spoke with him last night. Thanked him for letting me run damage control for him. He said he'd try to jump online this evening so he could get summarily booted off the porch to hang with the rest of the pups.
Now, before everyone gets their own alotted chunk of Matt's ass, be assured that what he posted was with a sense of humor and the zeal of a young guy still rolling in the wake of a pretty good season of hunting. Not to mention the fact that he popped the cherry on a new rifle with two kills Saturday not knowing if he'd made a good investment or not. I'd rather have to reign him back than build am fire under his ass any day. In time, he'll learn the benefits of "walking down that hill" and "screwing all those cows". LOL
One other footnote to my above post on Bob henderson to put into context the difference between what we have here compareed to those areas that have employed ADC personnel. Bob came to Kansas many years ago from doing ADC work in the Dakotas. He quickly found that the techniques that worked there are not nearly as effective here, and the system he developed thru trial and error is what we have here now. Since our depredation loss figures are under better control than most states, coupled with the fact that we're a major producer of cattle (one of the biggest, mind you) and other livestock, we may not be doing it western style, but we're getting the job done all the same.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Andy L
HI, I'M THE NEW MODERATOR OF THE CENTRAL MISSOURI FORUM, PULL MY FINGER!
Member # 642
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posted May 29, 2006 09:02 AM
Rich, not ALL ranchers are like that around here, but there are enough. Most just dont understand, thats all. Like the guy above, they are frustrated because they lost a $600+ calf (at least would have been had everything went right to sale) and gotta blame it on something. Cant be where, when or how they had em. They have been chewed on so it must have been those evil coyotes. Funny thing about this particular guy, his neighbors never have any trouble with calf kills...
My family have been ranchers around here forever and my dad or grandfather neither one remember ever having a calf killed. Now when they used to raise pigs on the ground, thats a whole new ballgame. I guess I was a little wreckless with my statement. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Yeah Lance, you cant shoot anything from the road in MO. Im not exactly sure of the law, but I think you have to be 50' from the center of the roadway? And you cant shoot out of a vehicle unless you have a handicap exemption and then you must be stationary, off the road. Thats why I cant understand how the hound guys get away with what they do. Practically all of their shooting is done off the road and most out the window.
Its no secret how I feel about the houdsmen. I guess mostly because of their legal trespass and shooting from the roads have messed me up so many times. It really pisses me off to figger out a stand, walk in and hear a pack of dogs running. Wasted time. Happens all too often. I had a honey hole for several years until the dogmen found it. Now its not worth going out there. Seems if they arent there when I go, they have already been there recently. It used to be really good.
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Andy
Posts: 2645 | From: Central Missouri | Registered: Apr 2005
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted May 29, 2006 09:28 AM
Andy, I wasn't disagreeing with you. I just pointed out the differences in coyote behavior or ranchers perceptions in a given area.
I know a rancher in Casa Grande that doesn't believe coyotes are a problem for his stock. Another that runs his cattle less than five miles away told me to kill all that I can. Coyotes had killed $7000 in calves that year. Small operation, must have been very expensive calves. A few months ago ranchers in SE Az.paid $200 an hour for aerial gunning. They must have been convinced that coyotes were doing significant damage to foot such a hefty bill.
Ranchers see a coyote feeding on calf remains or they may only see tracks around the carcass and some will blame the coyote without knowing how the calf died.
I know a rancher in SE Az. I like this guy and enjoy his company. He hates coyotes. He's convinced that they kill his cattle. He told me last year that he saw two coyotes attacking a range bull that was slowed down by hock deep mud within a hundred yards of his house. What can you say?
Normally, I just don't think that coyotes are a threat to a cattle operation.
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted May 29, 2006 09:32 AM
Good posts Lance, and I had no idea of the situation down there, or where Andy is for that matter. It's a big country and I really never put much thought into what goes on elsewhere. On another note, it has always been amazing to me that the guys that make pretty good money in ADC work are the guys that work privately in suburbia removing squirrels, skunks, and other rodents and animals. Farmers and ranchers are notoriously cheap regardless of where you are at. But someone that is having things go bump in the night in their house will pay out the nose to have those sounds and smells go away pronto. I'll bet that the same farmers that don't want to pay you, would think nothing of spending thousands to have their house treated for termites or things along those lines.
[ May 29, 2006, 09:33 AM: Message edited by: Cal Taylor ]
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted May 29, 2006 09:44 AM
Greenside,
I hunt alot of sage brush,mixed with grass type country.I usually am at the top of some small rolling hills or on the base of some larger hills(mountains),So most times I have a good vantage point of the coyotes coming in.If coyotes do come from the sides of me then I usually pick them up from between 200 yards up to 1/2 mile away.Good Hunting Chad
[ May 29, 2006, 09:48 AM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 10:04 AM
Thanks, Cal. Truth be known, I love living in Kansas, but I often try to look at my backtrail and see just where I might have made a different decision that would have put me in place like yours doing a job like yours. I've got a friend that I played little league with all our childhood (my dad was our coach) who is now doing lion control in Malhuer County, Oregon. I'm envious of both you guys for living what I would love to have for a life. Then again, when I retire in 14 years....
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Az-Hunter
Hi, I'm Vic WELCOME TO THE U.S. Free baloney sandwiches here
Member # 17
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posted May 29, 2006 10:58 AM
I can't speak to Chads' particular experiences, but I have had coyotes blow by me anywhere from five feet, to fifty yards,and never turn a whisker. They just want to get to the wailing rabbit.
Posts: 1627 | From: 5 miles west of Tim | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 11:48 AM
Me, too. Quite the experience if you don't hear them coming up behind you. Even moreso if you do.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted May 29, 2006 12:25 PM
The area that i call in the ranchers say they don't have a problem with coyotes as long as they don't see them in large groups like 3-4. The ranchers said that in winter the coyotes come closer to the ranch house to feed on rabbits that live around the hay stacks but have not been a problem with the cattle or horse's. In the spring they hang around the cattle and eat the afterbirth and calf droppings. One rancher even claims that he has a coyote that comes up to the ranch house in early mourning and plays tag with his blueheeler. On another note i have a rancher friend that calls me every fall to see when i will be comeing out, On his ranch he has alot of mule deer and the coyotes there have been preying on them. I thought that he was maybe blowing it a little out of proporsion. I went out the following week and from what i saw he was right on the money, i found three kill sites and what was left of the deer. I was able to take two coyotes off of his unit out of eight that week. And i got hold of a friend that lives out that way and had him come in and he got four over the winter. Shooting from the road: i dont have a problem with it, and have done it quiet a few times. Where i hunt you can shoot right from the window of truck if you wish to do so.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5064 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted May 29, 2006 03:04 PM
Boy, it's not that way in The People's Republic of California. Don't even THINK about shooting from a road, and they define damned near any faint two track as a road. It's NEVR okay to shoot from a vehicle, or even off the hood of a vehicle.
In answer to Cal's question, yes, I also have coyotes run right past me, if I'm backdoored from upwind. I generally sit directly in front of a creasote or a mesquite, and I might hear them coming, but I just have to concentrate real hard on freezing, until they pass.
None of this is graven in stone, but putting a label on a stand, like calling "downwind" is sure to cause doubts and disagreements. Some places, you need to be loose, "play the lie", as they say on the golf course.
It has a lot to do with cold calling, and having a fairly high population, and mile after mile of the same cover. I believe, in specific areas, that upwind is probably the way to go? But in other areas, (and just say there was a contest situation), the guy with a clear view downwind will hand him his ass. You just have to know how to deal with it.
Good hunting. LB
[ May 29, 2006, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31459 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Krustyklimber
prefers the bunny hugger pronunciation: ky o tee
Member # 72
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posted May 29, 2006 03:07 PM
Lance,
If no offense was taken, why was it offered?
I make a joke, or more correctly GO ALONG with a joke, and you go for the jugular...
"How many have YOU killed Krusty?"
No matter how many times I hear that, it still hits like a punch in the gut, every time.
I'm pretty sure the answer is ONE (or none), I have no proof either way (but I doubt "the mountain coyote" survived for long, just long enough to elude me before bleeding out).
Try and remember that, so you don't have to ask again (especially in spite, when it's not germain to the topic at hand).
It's not like I haven't tried.
I'm up against a pretty big challenge here myself. And I never give up.
I know I don't have what it takes to get off the porch and run with the big dogs, but I think I have paid my dues in my own way, FOR THE PLACE I AM.
I don't think it's right for you to try and take the credit I deserve for that away from me (particularly when you yourself dubbed me "official" not so long ago).
I don't have a problem with Matt, his math skills, or his zeal.
I just thought it was too good of a joke to keep to myself.
I'll think twice next time.
Krusty
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Think about how stupid the average person is, then realize that half of them are stupider than that!
Posts: 1912 | From: Deep in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted May 29, 2006 03:21 PM
Don't get your krust up, K. Just funnin' with ya. With all the time and effort you've put into this game, I'll be the first to give you an honorary place on the porch. You've earned that much. One of these days, you're gonna win a trip someplace and instead of the cruise offered, you'll take someone up on their offer to put you on countless coyotes. And when you get there, you'll do fine. Play nice.
Leonard,
Believe it or not, there are times when I use that wind issue to my advantage. After all, the li'l bastards are going there anyway and I can't stop them. Why not set up to cover the route between where they are and where they're going to end up downwind and let 'em have it on the way. That's pretty much what we did Saturday morning, and for the record, I set Matt downwind of me as an intercept. His being where he was and the factb that that coyote trekked right in front of him weren't just an accident. Hey, it worked.
[ May 29, 2006, 03:24 PM: Message edited by: Cdog911 ]
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted May 29, 2006 06:35 PM
Vic,
I have had a few of those kamakazi coyotes that fly by with no regard for anyone or anything but getting that rabbit. But like I said MOST of the time I see them coming from quite a ways out.Good Hunting Chad
Posts: 1612 | From: Utah | Registered: Jan 2003
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JD
HONORARY OKIE .... and Tim's at fault!
Member # 768
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posted May 29, 2006 09:08 PM
One time I was hunting in some hilly cedar country & set up facing downwind in a 10mph wind during a heavy snowfall, I stood back in a tall cedar where I could see both crosswinds & down wind with a good view, after about 5 min. I felt something against my leg & looked down behind me in the tree in time to see a flash of fur, I guess the coyote didn`t have a clue until he brushed against my leg & caught a whiff of me, he dove over a bank & disappeared before I could get the crosshairs on him.
So in a moment of stupidity I moved around the tree to face the other way & about 10 min. later a coyote coyote blew past me just a few feet away dropped over the same bank into the thick trees that the first one did.
I picked up the call & looked at the tracks from the second coyote & they had come "almost" from directly downwind, had I stayed with the set up that I "knew" was a better set up for the area I would have had ample opportunity to shoot the second coyote.
I prefer to call crosswind with a view of the downwind if at all possible but it just goes to show that you never know when the exception is going to backdoor you. The reason I chose to call directly downwind to begin with was due to terrain & the fact that I was on HIGH ground & my scent would probably stay above the lower terrain & the wind would carry the sound better down through the cedars.
I did move on down the road & stick with what I knew was right & killed a couple coyotes before the day was over so I guess I can laugh about it now.
Never a dull moment.
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Jason
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What do Obama & TA17Rem have in common........both are clueless asshats!!!
Posts: 1456 | From: NE. | Registered: Dec 2005
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