The New Huntmastersbbs!: Interrogation vs. Integration

This is topic Interrogation vs. Integration in forum Predator forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.

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Posted by TRnCO (Member # 690) on March 22, 2007, 07:18 PM:

What's in a name of a howl. How many guys say one or the other, or are both correct? I think a "pro" is confused,(maybe a mis-print), BUT I'm still in 1st grade on the "names" that designate different howls. SO is there a howl that is called the Integration?

Also, while I am it, do you think it is probable or even possible to call a coyote from 3 miles away? How about 2 miles away?

Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on March 22, 2007, 07:34 PM:

Integration? Could it be what I have heard referred to by Rich H as the assembly howl? Different name? I've never heard of it.
2-3 miles is one hell of a ways to get the sound out there. I can hear the road traffic from that far off but a call going that far and getting a response, no less? Hell's no!

Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on March 22, 2007, 07:37 PM:

I read that as well. I thought perhaps, from the text, he was integrating barks with howls, it never occurred to me that he actually meant interrogation howls. That would put a different spin to the whole article. Maybe you are right.
Scott Huber related a story about an aquaintance that howled a pair in from 6 miles away. Back tracked them in the snow.

Posted by TRnCO (Member # 690) on March 22, 2007, 07:51 PM:

He used "integration" several times and I guess I assumed it to be a misprint, BUT I wouldn't know!

Ya suppose those coyotes just happen to be traveling towards the stand before Scott started calling, or did he assume they started toward his stand only after he started calling?

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on March 22, 2007, 09:03 PM:

Wouldn't hurt to give a brief explain, I don't know what you fellers are talking about? I suspect there are others that have not read this article. Who wrote it and where does it appear?

Scott told the story before, where they backtracked to where the animals were headed in one direction and turned abruptly, and came straight to the call. Who would bother doing that for six miles, in the snow, is beyond me, but my hat is off to him? Probably airplane?

Good hunting. LB

Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on March 23, 2007, 07:52 AM:

NO NO NO!

Don't Sly what I have stated!

Slim Pedersen, formerly of Ekalaka Montana, was once observing a pair of coyotes feeding on a carcass, he said he watched them tip their heads back and howl. I believe he was just watching their behavior at a carcass which is quite interesting to observe. He said a while later another pair of coyotes showed up. He said he backtracked them to where they had heard the howl. If memory serves me right, I believe it was further than 6 miles. I'd have to ask him to confirm.

Was it circumstantial? Who knows!

False conclusions? Can't say!

Why would he backtrack a pair that far to see where they came from? Excellent question Leonard! I wouldn't either.

I guess I'd like to believe that those coyotes relayed that they were feeding on a carcass to pull another pair that far but in a sparsely populated area during the dead of winter and during the mating season, simple companionship could bring them together.

I think what's more important than anything else to learn from this observation is how far coyotes can hear eachother under certain conditions.

~SH~

[ March 23, 2007, 07:53 AM: Message edited by: Wiley E ]

Posted by Kelly Jackson (Member # 977) on March 23, 2007, 08:42 AM:

TR - I watched Bowmania last night......hitting coyotes on the move with a Bow....that was strong.
Good job.
Kelly

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on March 23, 2007, 09:27 AM:

edit: "NO NO NO"

Okay, Scott. That's a little harsh, you think I "Sly'd" you? What I said fits your explanation, even though it is a bit misleading. Read on~

quote:
Scott told the story before, where they backtracked to where the animals were headed in one direction and turned abruptly, and came straight to the call. Who would bother doing that for six miles, in the snow, is beyond me, but my hat is off to him? Probably airplane?

You just can't pick up a hurt pup without him snapping at ya.....

Good hunting. LB

[ March 23, 2007, 09:30 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]

Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on March 23, 2007, 09:44 AM:

Sorry for the misunderstanding Leonard, I was referring mostly to Righ Higgins statement.

Rich Higgins: "Scott Huber related a story about an aquaintance that howled a pair in from 6 miles away. Back tracked them in the snow."

The aquaintance did not do the howling. The coyotes on the carcass did.

Your statement.....

Leonard: "Scott told the story before, where they backtracked to where the animals were headed in one direction and turned abruptly, and came straight to the call."

TO THE CALL sounds like someone called them in from 6 miles away.

Once again, just trying to keep things accurate.

Don't go postal on me. LOL! One Sly is enough.

~SH~

[ March 23, 2007, 09:45 AM: Message edited by: Wiley E ]

Posted by TRnCO (Member # 690) on March 23, 2007, 10:55 AM:

Leonard, the article is in the latest Pred. X mag. written by Bob Severe. Several times in this one article he uses "interagation" call.

For example, in discribing what he calls "let's get together" call I quote, "By putting some friendly barks and howls together you can make one of the mnost useful sounds to the predator caller - the integration howl."

He goes on through this article discribing several howls with discrptions such as the "You're in Deep Trouble Now" howl and the "Get Lost of Get Whopped" howl and the "Wanna Get Lucky" howl etc. and in several places he uses integration and no where does he use interrogation, and I see no where that he mentions the dreaded "estrous chirp"! [Roll Eyes]

To call a coyote from even 3 miles seems like a stretch to me, BUT only sitting for 15 minutes on the norm. probably would have something to do with that! I beleive a coyote could hear a howler from that far anyways, but for it to come that far to investigate, I wouldn't bet the farm on it!

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on March 23, 2007, 11:34 AM:

quote:
"For example, in discribing what he calls "let's get together" call I quote, "By putting some friendly barks and howls together you can make one of the mnost useful sounds to the predator caller - the integration howl."
"You're in Deep Trouble Now" howl and the "Get Lost of Get Whopped" howl and the "Wanna Get Lucky" howl etc. and in several places he uses integration and no where does he use interrogation"(?)

Well, I don't know the guy, so will give him the benefit of the doubt. But I don't think those colorful descriptive labels can be supported by fact?

Did he use the term, "yote" in the article? Just wondering?

Good hunting. LB

edit: PS are the typos yours, or are they in the magazine?

[ March 23, 2007, 11:37 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]

Posted by Rich (Member # 112) on March 23, 2007, 12:14 PM:

I sort of skipped through that article. The poor author knows more about writing articles than he does about coyote language. I see he likes to push Knight and Hale calls. Knight & Hale. They are TURKEY hunters mostly ain't they?. [Wink]

Posted by Paul Melching (Member # 885) on March 23, 2007, 12:32 PM:

I just love this forum. I read that article last night and was just waiting to see how long before these colorful descriptions would be brought up here.As a newcomer to predator hunting/calling
I feel I get better info here than other places.
a lot less sifting through the bullshit to find the ice cream.
Thanks guys!
Paul

Posted by TRnCO (Member # 690) on March 23, 2007, 02:06 PM:

That's my point Leonard, are they typos or is there an "integration" howl?

Another quote, "The integration howl goes like this: two long friendly howls, a friendly bark, a short pause, then a short friendly howl followed by a long friendly howl."

on edit: Kelly I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Notice that the moving coyotes that I shot were either coming straight at me or going straight away, makes it a little easier to hit them! [Big Grin]

[ March 23, 2007, 02:07 PM: Message edited by: TRnCO ]

Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on March 23, 2007, 02:11 PM:

Yea, I had to laugh at some of those discriptions in his article as well.It's kind of funny how once you hear someone reference a coyotes vocalizations like that,you really don't read it as seriously.lol Good Hunting Chad

Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on March 23, 2007, 03:07 PM:

Utah: "It's kind of funny how once you hear someone reference a coyotes vocalizations like that,you really don't read it as seriously."

Or when someone refers to coyotes as "dogs" considering the obvious confusion it leads to with those who work with dogs and coyotes.

~SH~

Posted by JD (Member # 768) on March 23, 2007, 03:30 PM:

quote:
But I don't think those colorful descriptive labels can be supported by fact?

That`s exactly what I thought Leonard, unfortunately there are hoards of new hunters that will be so ****** up with their howling after reading that jibberish that they`ll never call a coyote with a howler.

[ March 23, 2007, 03:31 PM: Message edited by: JD ]

Posted by 2dogs (Member # 649) on March 23, 2007, 03:33 PM:

Wolves can hear howls for miles, why not coyotes. I've stalked enough coyotes. Not to underestimate their hearing ability. Even in a hard wind.

A cross or quartering wind is better for stalking coyotes. Better, than from down wind if given a choice.

Don't believe it. Try stalking in on one, on loud ground cover.

Posted by CrossJ (Member # 884) on March 23, 2007, 04:40 PM:

Haven't read the article yet, magazine just came today. I didn't subscribe, so I'm assuming its from the list at the campout that I added my name and address to. The reason I assume that is that they spelled my name correctly LOL. Thanks to whomever.
Scott, I got to talk to Slim Pederson at the NTA convention this year. The fact that he tracked those coyotes as far as he did doesnt suprise me. We talked about cat trapping and cat behaviour, and my assumption is that he's followed his fair share of cat tracks also. Just wished I had had more time to talk to him without alot of other people interrupting. Maintain,Geordie

Posted by Melvin (Member # 634) on March 23, 2007, 06:03 PM:

Jason,i thought the very same thing when i read it.
This one really stuck out.
*Change the barks and howls to get the sound'YOU'are comfertable with.* What about the coyote?

Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on March 23, 2007, 06:20 PM:

Melvin,

Coyotes don't buy magazines. They don't have thumbs and can't turn the pages. It's the readers that the Editors try to appease.

Posted by JD (Member # 768) on March 24, 2007, 03:05 PM:

Exactly!!! Coyotes don`t buy stuff, people do, what else really matters to editors or the writers?

Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on March 25, 2007, 07:53 PM:

I read the article the other day when mine came to the box. Along with the secretive and exciting "integration howl" he also introduced me to the "Female Invitational" howl. Is there some kind of derby involved with this howl?
I like the idea of an Invitational howl it sounds so competitive.
Female invitation is misleading and inaccurate, anyway. Right, WileyE! Males and females will respond. Are you trying to sound female? Or attract females? Come on and name it correctly w/ out misleading the calling public. 96.2% of the time it's impossible to determine the sex of a howling coyote. Unless they are Alpha's and you are Sly! Did they respond because they were invited or because they wanted companionship or just horny and young? Right, WileyE! Right!

I know the answers to these questions and more. Call my 900 number and find out for only $6.95/ min.

Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on March 26, 2007, 07:20 AM:

96.2%?
I think the correct percentage is 96.3. Right, WileE! Right?

Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on March 26, 2007, 07:22 AM:

Smithers,

Did you understand the point you were trying to make?

~SH~

Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on March 26, 2007, 08:09 AM:

$6.95 and I will tell you!

Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on March 26, 2007, 11:23 AM:

that's funny, I don't care who you are

Posted by Randy Roede (Member # 1273) on March 31, 2007, 05:34 PM:

Interrogation is what I get when the wife hears me coming home late, Integration is when I get home late and she doesn't.

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