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Author
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Topic: Alpha Coyotes
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tlbradford
Rimfires are MAGIC on COYOTES! If you do your part
Member # 1232
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posted March 25, 2007 01:34 PM
Rich H's post got me wondering about some things.
How often have you seen the biggest/strongest coyote in the group not be the alpha male or female?
Also, when will the younger coyotes start challenging for supremacy as the alpha's start declining? I imagine the answers to both these questions will vary wildly depending on population density, and availability of quality habitat.
If anyoe has an article that discusses this, I would love to get pointed to it.
Thanks in advance.
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"Dan Carey ain't that special" - LB
Posts: 423 | From: Spokane Valley, WA | Registered: Mar 2007
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted March 26, 2007 11:16 AM
I don't see how this question can be addressed by the average coyote hunter, and I accept the professional studies with suspicion.
You have a group of coyotes. You observe them. You shoot all the males and weigh them. You match your evaluation with the data. Do you find out that the biggest coyote is the alpha male, or do you discover that it's the size of the fight in the dog, and not the dog in the fight?
If two coyotes appear to be evenly matched, but one is dominate, that means we have a large male coyote that is happy to be bullied by another large male, rather than seek his own girl friend? Unlikely, in my view. In Africa, a pair of brothers might control a pride of lionesses, but this ain't Africa, and coyotes don't (usually) collect harems.
Therefore, my guess is that it should be fairly easy to observe a dominate male by his actions and the fact that the other males would be younger and smaller...in most cases, perhaps? This should be very difficult to determine in the vast majority of hunting situations.
Anybody else want to take a crack at the question? I'm just an amateur with an opinion.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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tlbradford
Rimfires are MAGIC on COYOTES! If you do your part
Member # 1232
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posted March 26, 2007 11:40 AM
Thanks Leonard, I agree with everything you have stated. Especially in reference to having to observe the group as a whole to determine the dominate animals.
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"Dan Carey ain't that special" - LB
Posts: 423 | From: Spokane Valley, WA | Registered: Mar 2007
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slydog
Knows what it's all about
Member # 389
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posted March 26, 2007 12:51 PM
Well, I have already given the determining factors I use in my perseption of what I consider an "alpha" male to be. Maybe for all the scientists here at HM I should refer to them as "adult males" so's not to confuse the issue. I collect data for "MY" use and to further my understanding. I also am open to learn and further my knowledge but bottom line, I want responce and opertunity. I'm willing to shair my information with anyone who wants it, along with it comes my thoughts on the matter.
I'm in no way a book learned expert on coyote behavior, I try to evaluate my hunting to produce more coyotes. I do tend to pay more heed to my observations in the field than I do to popular belife and or scientific studys as much of the written word don't always apply.
From my expieriance, Most of the time the bigger more commanding type males who tend to lead or show aggression, through vocalization or actions are what I consider to be "Alpha's"
Along with that there is always an exception to the rule. I have seen a 2-3 year old male with a larger 4-5 year old female but that is the exception not the rule, at least in my country.
Just my 2 cents
sly
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Smote the Yote with a slydog custom call
Posts: 179 | From: SW Idaho | Registered: Aug 2004
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted March 26, 2007 01:19 PM
quote:
I do tend to pay more heed to my observations in the field than I do to popular belife and or scientific studys as much of the written word don't always apply. (sly)
That's exactly what I do. If we don't agree on specific details, it's an honest difference of opinion.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31450 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 01:42 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:13 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 02:02 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted March 26, 2007 04:07 PM
quote:
My oldest coyote, a male[looking @ the teeth/muzzle area].
Neat trick, most of us determine the gender by looking at the other end.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 04:15 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 04:17 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 04:20 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted March 26, 2007 04:48 PM
I didn't find Tim's comments annoying at all. Rather comical actually.
You need to stop trying to be the "Alpha" 2 Dogs, it's not working for you at all. I think your sights are still set too high.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 04:55 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 04:58 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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Rich Higgins
unknown comic
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posted March 26, 2007 05:19 PM
tlbradford, an alpha is any male, regardless of age or weight, that bonds with a female, breeds her and helps raise the pups.
Cal and Tim, I will gladly share with you my program that opens 2dogsf*****g's posts. It's theme music is Michael Jackson hysterically shreiking "I'M BAD! I'M BAD! Kind of a hoot. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted March 26, 2007 05:42 PM
I have seen alot of these Alpha males. When i would have 3 or 4 coyotes come in, there was always one that barked and howled the most and make small charges at the caller. They were the ones i shot first, turned out that it was just a young pup that did'nt know any better. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5064 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 05:43 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted March 26, 2007 05:45 PM
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHH The pain! The pain!
2Ducks doesn't like me. Whatever will I do. LOL!
You crack me up 2Ducks!
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 05:46 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:13 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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2dogs
Knows what it's all about
Member # 649
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posted March 26, 2007 05:57 PM
[ March 26, 2007, 06:13 PM: Message edited by: 2dogs ]
Posts: 1034 | From: central Iowa | Registered: Apr 2005
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted March 26, 2007 06:12 PM
OOPS!
Mis-type...
I meant you QUACK me up! Get it? QUACK me up!
2Ducks Quacks me Up! ROFLMAO!!!
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted March 26, 2007 06:23 PM
Dang Cal,
You just made me spew tea all over my monitor!
ROTFLMAO!
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Rob
Knows what it's all about
Member # 75
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posted March 26, 2007 06:37 PM
Duke. It's the Duke."Duke of Death."
The Duck, I says.
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"Where did all these #$%^&* Indians come from?" Gen. George Armstrong Custer
Posts: 224 | From: Clancy Montana | Registered: Feb 2003
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Melvin
Knows what it's all about
Member # 634
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posted March 26, 2007 06:46 PM
Cal,i got a question for you.Whats that little plug in for,below the light on the 416 b foxpro.Is that for charging the batteries,or what?I got a deal on one,but no papers.
Sorry for changing the subject,but i would like to know what thats for. ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Posts: 661 | From: PA. | Registered: Apr 2005
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varmit hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 37
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posted March 26, 2007 06:48 PM
I have always considered the 60 gr V-max to be the Alpha.
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Make them pay for the wind.
Posts: 932 | From: Orange,TX | Registered: Jan 2003
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