quote:

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I can see advantages to both, but I prefer my e-caller over mouth calls "most" of the time due to the ability to "setup" a realistic calling sequance ..........

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C whacker, what do you consider to be a "realistic" calling sequence and why.
(relax , I'm not bushwacking you.)
 

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Posted by Kokopelli (Member # 633) on August 11, 2008, 04:57 PM:
 
I belive that it was JH (credit where credit is due) who stated some time ago that; "......you will call just as many coyotes with a mouthcall as an e-caller, but you'll kill more with an e-caller."

I don't think that the difference would be a lot, and even less with one hunter calling & one hunter as the main shooter but I do agree with the concept.

Personally, I use both.....sometimes both at once.
 

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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on August 11, 2008, 05:43 PM:
 
I definitely prefer mouthcalls. The e-caller comes in handy if you remember to shoot or you don't place it too far away. Too far away can be 50 ft as I have discovered.
I have an idea of what CWhacker means by realistic calling sequence but I'll let him answer.
Whatever his answer is I plan on totally disagreeing with him and arguing for no reason. In the name of science.
 

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Posted by coyote whacker (Member # 639) on August 11, 2008, 05:46 PM:
 
At times I like to setup the scene like a family group hunting up a fawn deer and then fighting over food, I may add in some crow calls or magpie sounds to really make it sound like an authentic chase and kill scene. Can one do this on mouth calls? Sure some can but less movement and can change the location of this away from me and use that to my advantage some better with the e-caller.

I still use mouth calls and alot of times I will start with a howl on either and answer it with the opposite, but times when I want to make a chase/kill scene with the most realism that is where the e-caller works with less effort for me. A great setup for younger coyotes fresh on the scene or a pair late winter trying to keep intruders out of the area and working up their food source.

I'm sure in many hunted areas with the boom of e callers about that the mouth calls will come full circle, but I still like to be able to move that sound away from my spot and help dictait how those coyotes will approach my stand area.

I also feel alot more secure when trying (not yet succesful) of calling up a MT Lion to have that sound 30-40 yards away from me rather than me being the prey due to the heavier cover we hunt for them.

Many times a few howls,pup sounds and the rabbitt blues are all the realism we need and that can be done real effective with mouth calls. Lighter and less to pack, but I like being able to dictait when the wind isn't right with the remote aspect of still calling some stands and getting those coyotes to approach better where they don't know I'm there with the aid of an E caller.

I'll never give up using mouth calls and use them at 50% of my stands in some form or fashion but I rely heavy on my e caller and a great advancement into calling for sure.
 

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Posted by 5shots (Member # 427) on August 11, 2008, 07:09 PM:
 
I prefer the e-caller becaus I'm an amature and by the time I get to the stand I don't have enough wind left to do more than a ten second stand on a mouth call.
 

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Posted by 5shots (Member # 427) on August 11, 2008, 07:12 PM:
 
Future Rock Star? Well atleast I'm not a cheerleader. just kidding don't punish me Leonard.
 

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Posted by Bofire (Member # 221) on August 11, 2008, 07:14 PM:
 
Well, as Rich higgins gives me confidence, I am gonna post like I know sumthin, however in my best years I only get 15-20 coyotes. I hunt alone alot, I like the ecaller so that "if I set up right" I have a better chance of getting away with some movement, as the yote closes. I aint an expert, lots of times I like to do what I call "wake em up" with a howl or loud call for a few seconds but I call quiet more often, then go to medium quiet to real quiet, I keep a tiny coaxer sound on a preset, I lip squeak alot and puppy whimper alot on an open reed.
Carl
 

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Posted by TOM64 (Member # 561) on August 11, 2008, 07:41 PM:
 
I love it when all I have to do is punch a button and pull the trigger but my luck with e-callers hasn't been so good. They've all called plenty of coyotes when they work but they don't always work.

With handcalls I can carry plenty of backups and I seem to call in just as many if not more critters. And I'm lazy so I like to carry as little weight as possible.
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 11, 2008, 07:42 PM:
 
Thanks for the answers, I appreciate them all. But I'm still going to laugh when Smithers goes medieval scientific on you anyway.
 

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Posted by Andy L (Member # 642) on August 11, 2008, 07:50 PM:
 
FWIW, in alot of the areas I hunt, the e caller makes it much easier to make the coyote killable. As in bringing him down a fencerow, where the caller is placed, while I am off to one side where I wont be detected. If that makes any sense.

However, after spending some time with Higgins, I havent used my e caller. I am having too much fun wiht mouth calls. Not as easy to place a coyote sometimes, but still a hoot. And thats what its all about, for me anyhow.
 

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Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on August 11, 2008, 07:50 PM:
 
Hey 5Shots,

There's nothing wrong with being a Cheerleader ( Have you seen my long legs? ) And if I can talk Leonard into letting me modify sig lines, I can guarantee board participation will skyrocket, as some folks will be afraid to leave their computer, for fear of what it may be changed to.....

I hunt 50/50 when by myself, but if I'm calling for someone else to shoot, I prefer a mouth call, as it lets me change up depending on the situation.

When using an e-caller, it's rare for me to switch sounds on a stand. I play one good sound, if I don't get a response in 10-15 minutes, I move to a new location.
 

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Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on August 11, 2008, 08:05 PM:
 
Many moons ago, when I first started calling, and for many moons henceforth, I was a loner when it came to calling. Mainly because very few people around here did any calling, and because I just preferred to be alone when hunting. I've always been a traditionalist when it came to calls of choice and preferred the wind driven models over the electronics.

In recent years, I've been fortunate enough to have found a guy that shoots well enough and does what I've asked him (most of the time) and we have developed a pretty good system of calling between the two of us where we exploit the terrain and wind by me calling and him setting up in a sniper position to deal with any coyotes that seem intent on getting around me to the downwind side.

With the modern wireless, remote controlled e-callers, I can just as easily pull off a stand by positioning the caller in such a way as to entice the coyote to circle, and positioning myself in that ever popular sniper position where my wind won't be a factor, if I set up properly.

Another advantage I've found to the caller is twofold. First, crows are a blessing, and if I want or feel the need for a long-range decoy of sorts, that a coyote can both see and hear from a sizable distance, I just switch the caller over to crow sounds for as long as it takes to bring them on in. In this country, within minutes, those rat bastards will be hovering all over you. I've seen coyotes coming in to the call with their heads up watching the birds.

Also, I've had some luck combining the e-caller and mouthcalls by running a good jackrabbit distress then calling over it with a mouthcall that sounds quite a bit different. Doesn't work all the time but when you need to really get their attention and do something different, it's worth trying in the late season.

Whether one gets me more than the other, I don't know. Both types of calls are just tools and there are few stands when I don't have a lanyard full of tube calls around my neck along with an M-1 in my pocket.
 

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Posted by Rich (Member # 112) on August 12, 2008, 05:42 AM:
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I belive that it was JH (credit where credit is due) who stated some time ago that; "......you will call just as many coyotes with a mouthcall as an e-caller, but you'll kill more with an e-caller."
-----------------------------------------
Did John-Henry say that? I have been saying the same thing for many moons. I love hand calls, and believe I can call at least as many predators with the air driven models as I could with any E caller. The advantage of an E caller for me, comes in to play when calling the thicker cover. Coyotes are famous for circling down-wind of the screams. When using hand calls, this means that the coyote just came in down-wind of ME. He catches my scent and leaves without my even knowing that I called anything. Why? Because being a coyote, he slipped down-wind under cover of the brush. A remote controlled E caller placed upwind of the honey hole while I sit cross-wind, is my main method of killing more coyotes that I probably would not have even seen otherwise.
 

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Posted by Cdog911 (Member # 7) on August 12, 2008, 12:37 PM:
 
My point, too, Rich. Good addendum. And for the new guys that are still having trouble determining just what point we're trying to make on that, here is the clarification.

When hunting by yourself, coyotes will circle in cover and often get your wind and be gone without ever exposing themselves. By using an e-caller, you can place the caller in a location that forces a circling coyote to expose itself for the shot as it circles. Your task is to then position yourself in good cover that affords you a commanding view of that opening where the coyote is likely to appear, but at the same time, NOT pass downwind of you. I usually try to put 50-100 yards between myself and the caller, sitting downwind of the caller while, at the same time, leaving a bit of approach cover between me and the caller. By doing this, coyotes will circle downwind, pass between the caller and me, and often be on my side of the cover, using it for concealment because they perceive any possible threat to be coming from the area of the caller itself and do not realize that they're standing or passing right in front of me.

A lot of guys think e-callers are cost prohibitive. When you see how well this strategy works, and how much more fur you can put up by using the caller and the method, you quickly realize how fast an e-caller can pay for itself.
 

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Posted by TA17Rem (Member # 794) on August 12, 2008, 01:17 PM:
 
For me it depends on the area i hunt and what the weather is like. If an area is hit hard by other callers then i prefer to use the WT/B.C.B to bring them in. and if the wind is blowing..
And there are some days when i have to just chase them out of the corn.
 

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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on August 12, 2008, 05:53 PM:
 

quote:

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At times I like to setup the scene like a family group hunting up a fawn deer and then fighting over food, I may add in some crow calls or magpie sounds to really make it sound like an authentic chase and kill scene. Can one do this on mouth calls? Sure some can but less movement and can change the location of this away from me and use that to my advantage some better with the e-caller.

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quote:

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FWIW, in alot of the areas I hunt, the e caller makes it much easier to make the coyote killable. As in bringing him down a fencerow, where the caller is placed, while I am off to one side where I wont be detected. If that makes any sense.

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quote:

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With the modern wireless, remote controlled e-callers, I can just as easily pull off a stand by positioning the caller in such a way as to entice the coyote to circle, and positioning myself in that ever popular sniper position where my wind won't be a factor, if I set up properly.

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quote:

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When using hand calls, this means that the coyote just came in down-wind of ME. He catches my scent and leaves without my even knowing that I called anything. Why? Because being a coyote, he slipped down-wind under cover of the brush. A remote controlled E caller placed upwind of the honey hole while I sit cross-wind, is my main method of killing more coyotes that I probably would not have even seen otherwise.

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quote:

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And there are some days when i have to just chase them out of the corn.

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That'll work where there's corn! Gotcha!

With the help of SCIENCE I have cut you all off at the knees! Stick to your day jobs...
If you are a Democrat. Only 18 more days 'til, PAYDAY!!!

[ August 12, 2008, 05:54 PM: Message edited by: smithers ]
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 12, 2008, 06:44 PM:
 
I was willing to argue with him until the "nose full of receptors" thing. Then I knew I didn't have a chance. Danged science.
 

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Posted by Rich (Member # 112) on August 12, 2008, 07:48 PM:
 
Smithers,
Are you trying to beat Browning204 out of his Champion shit slinger title?
 

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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on August 12, 2008, 07:55 PM:
 
It's not ME, Mister Richard Cronk, it's science!

From a purely scientific perspective. A total of zero coyotes per year would be killed using the aforementioned techniques.

I wondered who would be the first to argue with SCIENCE! I had no idea it would be you.
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 12, 2008, 09:49 PM:
 

Leonard keeps screwing with your sigline and he's going to seriously hurt me. I just pulled something.
 

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Posted by Randy Roede (Member # 1273) on August 13, 2008, 06:20 AM:
 
Randy, I thought when I started reading your post about a family group of coyotes hunting deer with crows circling that I was in Kentucky!!!!!!!

Have you found a new mentor???

LOL!!!!
 

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Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on August 13, 2008, 10:52 AM:
 
Many coyotes were killed with hand calls long before most e-callers came on the market. Prior to their abuse, E-callers allowed success for many recreational callers who were less confident and less proficient with hand calls. Both handcalls and e-callers have their place and both will call coyotes. The better the understanding of coyote behavior in any particular area by the person doing the calling, the better the success that will be garnered by either hand calls or e-callers.

The advantages of the e-caller, as Whacker and others have pointed out, is getting the sound away from you to allow for better stand setups where you can take advantage of a coyote circling the caller in various habitat and wind situations. Another advantage of e-callers is the diversity of sounds and combinations of sounds that are available to the caller as has also been pointed out. Most e-callers offer a diversity of sounds beyond those most commonly used and abused. In areas where coyotes readily feed on carcasses in the company of crows and magpies, those combination sound setups will appear totally natural as opposed to the common "no brainer" sounds that might be abused by others. We know what sounds work when we achieve success but we often never realize what sounds may have created little to no interest or even repelled coyotes for one reason or another. Another advantage of e-callers can be the added volume needed on windy days or topography features and other factors that minimize volume allowing more coyotes to be reached.

The advantages of hand calls is that those who are proficient with them can make sounds that are often more realistic in situations where e-callers have been abused. With every e-caller I have ever heard, there is a degree of distortion background speaker noise. Some worse than others which is why I am a fan of the WT. In areas of heavy calling pressure, that background noise can easily be detected by coyotes that could associate that background noise with danger. The background speaker noise, in combination with a prey distress sound, followed by shooting and missing is much like the buzzer preceding the shock of a shock collar. In contrast, the day coyotes stop being attracted to natural prey sounds is the day they quit eating. There is no doubt in my mind that speaker distortion can become a red flag when abused. The more realistic the sound, the more effective it will be much like the difference in reactions between human vocalizations vs. electronic howls. Anything can be abused with over use. When you think of how many guys are trying to call coyotes to a pickup from a road with an e-caller or call coyotes that have seen the callers move in to their stand, it's only a matter of time before they associate those same distortion sounds with danger.

In situations where I believe e-callers have been used and abused, I prefer more natural sounds with hand calls and other more natural vocalizations. Hand callers are also more convenient when packing rifle and/or shotgun, shooting sticks, binoculars, range finders, etc. during longer distant approaches to a calling stand.

When I first started calling coyotes for control work and seeking good advise, I preferred the advise of those who protected large numbers of range sheep for a living. The advise from those men was based on killing every coyote as a necessity as opposed to the advise of those who didn't care how many they missed or didn't call. Those who protected large bands of range sheep found out how many they didn't call because the killing wouldn't stop until all the adult coyotes were removed. In contrast, when receiving advise from those who protected 400 lb. calves from 30 lb. coyotes, it didn't matter to them how many they didn't call or how many they missed, they were heros for just showing up. LOL!

Hey smithers, since you appear to enjoy judging post presentation more than judging post content, I thought I would point out that I am trying to be less confrontational with my posts. How am I doing? Did this one pass the Smithers post evaluation presentation test for political correctness or do I need to pass out more flowers and kiss more babies? LOL!

~SH~

[ August 13, 2008, 01:04 PM: Message edited by: Wiley E ]
 

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Posted by LionHo (Member # 233) on August 13, 2008, 11:52 AM:
 
Most guys that have come to the sport in the past few years probably get bamboozled into spending as much for an ecaller as a good rifle when time spent scouting for places to hunt with less calling pressure would be a much better investment.

Twenty plus years of calling cats to the camera suggests the best reason to use an ecaller is to take the focus off me. It's not that an ecaller is particularly more effective at calling critters. Hell, I've lip-squeaked bobcats and foxes and coyotes to within a few feet of me. Now, getting flanked by a pair of mountain lions working together last fall was reason enough to beg off of the fawn hand call, but if I was a recreational coyote hunter--which, admittedly I'm not-- I'd probably hark back to mouth calls and lipsqueaks for 90% of my calling hereabouts.

I'll also chime in that most ecallers I've heard sound like dung and that's why I got into building my own. Prior to this, I found hand calls and lipsqueaks more effective as they were more realistic, that is to say that until just a few years back commercial ecallers had no high-frequency component whatsoever. (Several notoriously over-hype their speaker's actual frequency response).

LionHo
 

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Posted by tlbradford (Member # 1232) on August 13, 2008, 01:06 PM:
 

quote:

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Hey smithers, since you appear to enjoy judging post presentation more than judging post content, I thought I would point out that I am trying to be less confrontational with my posts. How am I doing? Did this one pass the Smithers post evaluation presentation test for political correctness or do I need to pass out more flowers and kiss more babies? LOL!

~SH~

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You really are running for sheriff!!

Go ahead and be confrontational, that is when we learn the most anyway.
 

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Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on August 13, 2008, 02:39 PM:
 
TL: "You really are running for sheriff!!"

If you saw my belly you'd sure think so. Haha!

~SH~
 

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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on August 13, 2008, 05:01 PM:
 
Scientifically speaking, Mr. Scott Huber, that was a fantastic post!
The others in the bunch were good as well but yours SHINES! Sincerely.

Content: A++
Delivery: A++

Sheriff!
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 13, 2008, 05:49 PM:
 
I agree with, Smithers. Extraordinary.
 

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Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on August 13, 2008, 06:55 PM:
 
Allright, things are getting way too cozy here. A++ on two fronts???? I'm circling down wind.

~SH~
 

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Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on August 13, 2008, 07:14 PM:
 
Hell, I'll give you a thumbs up, too.
 

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Posted by smithers (Member # 646) on August 13, 2008, 08:19 PM:
 
Here is the main problem that I, personally, have when using an e-caller. Mind you I own a couple and use them sparingly, one larger unit and a smaller 5 sound deal.
A nearly infinite number of sounds at the touch of a button is wonderful and a curse. With 100- 200 sounds to choose from it is hard to develop a "routine", for me. It takes strict discipline not to start tapping buttons when something doesn't show after 6 minutes. I don't have that discipline down with an e-caller, yet, as I do with a hand call.
The noise issue is a big one with me. When I can hear a "buzz" from twenty yards. Something's gotta give. The animal can hear it 3 times as far if not more.
Natural sounding coyote vocals are nearly non-existant unless you have a WT. But with a WT you have 100 different versions of the same basic howl to choose from. How does that happen?
I realize the fault mainly lies with me and my feeling that the next sound on the list will certainly work better than the current one playing.

I put off purchasing one as long as I could. 2 1/2 seasons with one and 1 1/2 with the other and I am still learning how to best utilize them. Hunting alone is the reason I purchased one and using it as a "hunting partner" is not as simple as I had thought.

[ August 13, 2008, 08:20 PM: Message edited by: smithers ]
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 14, 2008, 11:42 AM:
 
E-callers, when used with a motion decoy, are a tremendous aid in seducing a cat or an insecure coyote to expose itself in thick cover.
I place the combo in an upwind area of a small clearing so that the coyote that needs to see it or wind it must enter an open area to do so.
Like this:


When they see the deke it will often pull them right in like this:

 

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Posted by Jrbhunter (Member # 459) on August 14, 2008, 12:20 PM:
 
WileyE- that was the best post I've seen on a predator hunting forum in six months.
 

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Posted by MULE (Member # 63) on August 14, 2008, 12:43 PM:
 
Sultan Higgins,

I have never used a decoy before. There seems to be a gazillion and one choices,brands and types.
And they very greatly in price.

How did that Minaska decoy stack up against others you have used? What does it weigh?

What decoy would you recommend?
 

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Posted by coyote whacker (Member # 639) on August 14, 2008, 12:51 PM:
 
Randy R, it is not just in kentucky where coyotes kill deer or antelope it happens right here in western SD.

The cheyanne breaks have plenty of magpies and crows for that matter and they will signal to coyotes of a food source of deer carcass delight. I have seen a groups of magpies really work a deer carcass over in a few days time and those repsectable coyotes know what those magpie sounds are all about.Same with crows.

I have seen the evidance of both deer and antelope being killed and fed upon by coyotes as I'm sure you have as well. I had a goat kill 2 weeks ago the guy thought mt lion, looked it over and nope a family group of coyotes on a young antelope, slicked it up in a hurry. He was haying didn't see it one day and the very next, dead antelope strung about the prairie.On driving to inspect the carcass 3 crows came off of it.

Do I use this scene early summer? Nope, I use it in areas I know get more calling pressure and when it seems more natural for this type of scene to take place.

The ecaller has as many others stated the ability to disconnect us from the sound source be it 20 ft or 60+ yards or more. Realistic sounds are a bonus and having the ability to really change things up if needed are also a bonus. I have the self control to use what I know will work best in an area at that given time, but I'm also not afraid to experiment in the fall/winter with other sounds in areas that have had a few callers working it as well.I have a baby groundhog sound that works really well as a closer sound, I don't have groundhogs within 80 miles of me, but I don't know if the coyoes think of it as small coyote whimpers or another prey but I know it will call coyotes in an area void of groundhogs.

Being able to dictait alot of times the approach of those coyotes via e caller is something that can be very valuable and has helped me kill coyotes, when conditions where not ideal, versus mouth calls and maybe spooking the coyotes I needed away and giving them an education and making more work for me down the road.

I do use mouth calls and they have there place for sure, but I like the ability to move that sound away from my ambushing spot. Let them hone in on that sound being away from my position.

[ August 14, 2008, 12:57 PM: Message edited by: coyote whacker ]
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 14, 2008, 02:44 PM:
 
Hey Mule, dang it, you guys were trying to stick a nickname on me so I tossed you Redfrog and a write a caption contest and you STILL stick one on me.
I've played with a lot of decoys and some are definitely better than others. Cheap ones like a feather on a string work ok with a little breeze. Some airport gift shop battery powered toys are kinda fun to play with. The best in my opinion are the Whirling woodpecker and the quiver critter, both about 30 bucks. The very best one though is the Minaska Sidewinder. If those people fired me today I would still use and tell everyone it's the best. It has two motions... 180 degrees and random. Set on random it will drag a coyote or cat in by the eyeballs. Coyotes will lock onto this thing just like they do decoy dogs. Sometimes you can stand up and dance a little jig and they will ignore you. Kinda pricey at $100 but if you call thick cover it will pay for itself quickly.
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 14, 2008, 02:50 PM:
 
his is the Sidewinder adding movement to the decoy setup.


They work in open country also.. just aren't necessary


 

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Posted by MULE (Member # 63) on August 14, 2008, 03:10 PM:
 
Rich,

Thanks for the info

I am curious as to why you say they are not of much value in open country?

Alot of my calling is done in places that are very,very open and its tough to conceal yourself.

I was thinking that maybe if the coyote was visually fixated on the decoy then it would be less likely to see me

Also do you have an estimate on the weight of that sidewinder? Alot of the places I call I walk from stand to stand as opposed to driving between stands. I'm getting old so I am always looking to shed weight I am carrying
 

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Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on August 14, 2008, 04:07 PM:
 

quote:

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Thanks for the info

I am curious as to why you say they are not of much value in open country?

Alot of my calling is done in places that are very,very open and its tough to conceal yourself.

I was thinking that maybe if the coyote was visually fixated on the decoy then it would be less likely to see me

Also do you have an estimate on the weight of that sidewinder? Alot of the places I call I walk from stand to stand as opposed to driving between stands. I'm getting old so I am always looking to shed weight I am carrying

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Mule, I call with a camo net over me so it doesn't matter if I call from a plowed field(which I sometimes do) the coyotes still fixate on me and come on in, IF they are inclined to expose themselves. If they are not, then we move into their bedrooms in the heavy cover and the decoy does it's job.
I don't know the exact weight of the decoy. It feels like a couple of pounds. Much heavier at the end of a long day. A back pack for the call and deke and camera solves the problem. You can also get it as part of the Ultimate One. Check out the video clip.
http://www.minaskaoutdoors.com/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=10
 

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Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on August 14, 2008, 04:25 PM:
 
Here's something for you guys to think about within the discussion of educating coyotes to certain sounds. A number of towns in the west have a siren that goes off at 10:00PM each evening. In a number of cases, I have known of coyote dens within hearing distance of those town sirens. Although those sirens go off every evening and there is never a good or bad experience associated with it, these dens (adults and pups) would answer those sirens virtually every evening. Think about that in the realm of those who claim sirens are being abused. Sirens aren't necessarily being abused, sirens coming from roads preceeded by vehicle noise and followed with calling and shooting activities might be abused. Again it's the association to danger that creates the red flag as opposed to the siren itself. There's a lot we don't know guys.

Rich H.,

Very impressive photographs. You are an excellent photographer. I always enjoy the "coyotes in their natural habitat" pictures so much more than the "look at me" photos without scenery after the kill. If a fella is going to take a picture of dead coyotes, one might as well drag them to a place that showcases the habitat they were taken from. It sure makes a lot better picture.

Thanks jrb!

~SH~
 

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Posted by CrossJ (Member # 884) on August 14, 2008, 05:15 PM:
 
WileyE, to add to that, Steve Criner has some film footage he took while hunting here with me. It is of a coyote that we observed from a long distance. We never could get this coyote to respond to any type of calls(vocal or distress). We used the terrain and got in much closer. Again no responce from this coyote. A feed truck soon arrived and drove right past this coyote as it hid in the tall grass. After the rancher finished, he drove out past the same coyote. After he was gone, the coyote left and headed straight into the area that contained the yearlings being fed.
I know the particular cowboy and the ranch. I would wager that he feeds this group of cattle the same time every day, from the same truck. The coyote did not fear the truck(showed some caution), but accepted it as part of its environment. It appeared as if the coyote had patterned the rancher and had become conditioned to accept the trucks presence as none threatening. My guess would be if the particular rancher had showed up several hours later, or maybe even in a different truck, the coyotes behavior would have been much different.
FWIW, Geordie
 

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Posted by Wiley E (Member # 108) on August 14, 2008, 08:29 PM:
 
Yup Geordie, your calls may have been appealing but they weren't as appealing as the feed truck. This is why I harp on variables all the time. It's so easy to reach false conclusions for why a coyote reacts a certain way when there can be so many reasons for a particular reaction. Some of the fast buck artists in the trapping world do the same thing. They capitalize on the less informed because everyone is looking for a silver bullet solution to problems that are simply related to unpredictable coyote behavior and no fault of their own in many cases.

In many areas, coyotes follow tractors around because they usually don't associate tractors with danger. In the Conata Basin, they used to come to the sound of gunfire because it meant dead pr. dogs. Conditioned response! Food wins out over caution.

~SH~
 

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Posted by coyote whacker (Member # 639) on August 19, 2008, 01:26 PM:
 
Rich, "if they fired you today you would still use the sidewinder"?

Are you on the Minaska payroll? LOL!
 

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