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Posted by catskin (Member # 51) on May 08, 2003, 12:54 PM:
Ladders
I haven’t heard much mention of them since the Posse Country days. Does anybody here use them? I, myself have never tried it; I mean have a reputation to keep. I would have to be by myself, and drive *way* out into the pucker brush in a snow storm and hope like hell one of my friends never saw me!
I do know some area’s though that have old growth sage, maybe +6 ft tall and so thick you couldn’t see a coyote within 30 feet, it might look a lot different looking down on it.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 08, 2003, 01:20 PM:
Yeah, I agree. Plus where am I going to put one?
The application I see is high chaparral and creasote.
But, you might notice that Bill Rice, hunting partner of "ladder man" Michael McCasland has joined us. He is, without a doubt, a very good source for tips and strategy.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Q-Wagoner (Member # 33) on May 08, 2003, 02:14 PM:
I think if you look carefully at most ladders it says plainly on the top two steps “DO NOT SIT OR STAND.” I think they put that there for a reason. Personally I don’t think I would feel comfortable spinning around on top of a six-foot ladder trying to keep my balance and shoot at the same time. Call me crazy.
Good hunting.
Q,
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 08, 2003, 03:24 PM:
Q, I think some guys just stand high enough to rest the gun on the top, only one or two steps off the ground. At least that's what Jay Nistetter told me once?
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Bill (Member # 49) on May 08, 2003, 04:38 PM:
Catskin,
To answer your question, I use a ladder. I have now for several years. Prior to me using a ladder I knew several club member here in Tucson that used ladders. At the time I thought they must be some of the craziest guys I had ever met. After I started using a ladder I was certain they were, but now so was I. All the negative commments so far are absolutely correct. However using a ladder entends the field of view or allows stands to be made where most other callers will not waste their time on for lack of visibility. There's the advantage.
Bill
Posted by Q-Wagoner (Member # 33) on May 08, 2003, 05:11 PM:
I never thought about that possibility Leonard. The picture I remember seeing a while back was someone dressed up in some kind of “leafy type” camo perched on top of one like a turkey buzzard. All I can remember thinking when I saw that is that I would probably read a head line one day that would go something like this.
“Deranged hunter dressed like a bush found dead at the foot of a ladder.”
Late Thursday afternoon a group of hikers came upon a gruesome discovery. A man dressed up like a bush, “with a gun,” was found dead lying beside a latter in the desert of Arizona. Authorities are baffled. All though suicide has not been ruled out, one detective reports that the man would surely be a prime candidate for the Darwin awards. Alcohol may have played a role in the death……
Good hunting.
Q,
Posted by Jay Nistetter (Member # 140) on May 09, 2003, 11:14 AM:
As Leonard said, I use the top of the ladder to rest my elbows on.
I use a piece of die cut camo cloth for the front of the ladder to make it invisible, so it works well in wide open country too.
A guy in camo clothes carying a rifle and ladder sure causes some strange looks from both coyotes and people. There's no doubt that it scares people way more than coyotes.
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 09, 2003, 01:07 PM:
Hey Q, don't knock the ghillie suit till you've tried it in the deep woods ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
, those things really work,on all kinds of game! Much better than plain cammo!
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 09, 2003, 05:48 PM:
You must be a new guy around here, SE? Everyone knows that Jay hunts in plaid shirts and Marlboros, but he don't move.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 09, 2003, 06:17 PM:
Probably easy to do in the desert,where most everything is long range shooting
I'll bet he sits on his horse most of the time and in winter he wears a sherpa lined jacket with a high collar and a 10 gallon hat, right ?
Heck yeah I'm new here Leonard, I don't know squat about predator hunting, but I do know a bit about hunting in general,especially in the piney woods,where everything gets short range and almost personal !!
[ May 09, 2003, 06:18 PM: Message edited by: Seldom Ever ]
Posted by Jay Nistetter (Member # 140) on May 09, 2003, 09:34 PM:
SE, I quit hunting years ago. I let them hunt me. Hmmm. Maybe that's your problem.LOL
!!Afterthought!! Most shots in the desert are 75 yards down to within a couple feet. Let me qualify that some. Most SUCCESSFUL shots are....
Timber country isn't any different than other areas as far as predator hunting goes. First you gotta be in an area where dogs are. Second you gotta make a half-convincing sound. Third you gatta stay still. Fourth you gotta be careful where you lay your cigarette down before you take a shot.
[ May 09, 2003, 09:40 PM: Message edited by: Jay Nistetter ]
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 10, 2003, 02:52 AM:
Ahhhhhh, but timber country has a whole lot of something that desert doesn't...and that is cover,lots of it.
Thanks for the tips though Jay,much obliged.No worries on the cigs, hadn't had a smoke in 6 years or liquor in 14. I know you were just pulling my leg anyhow, can't see many people smoking and killing much of anything that has a nose.
[ May 10, 2003, 02:54 AM: Message edited by: Seldom Ever ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 10, 2003, 08:41 AM:
He's not pulling your leg about smoking on stand.
I haven't smoked in thirteen years or so, but before that, I killed just as many while smoking as not? No data, unfortunately. Maybe fortunately? Actually, I favored the Hava-Tampa Jewels; a much needed wooden tip to chew on after they went out; but I suppose they still stink, to a coyote's nose? You can suck a lot of flavor out of that tip, lasts for hours.
Forests, in general, are bad locations for hunting predators. You have to play the cards you are delt, but if you have any options, get out of that dense growth.
Interesting. The conceptions and misconceptions about western conditions. Arizona doesn't deserve the "desert" label, it's actually lush, compared to most of Nevada.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 10, 2003, 08:53 AM:
yeah,guess I should have used the term "near barren landscape".
No getting around the timber, except to hunt the thicketed edges of corn fields,overgrown clear cuts,etc.
I smoked cigs for 35 years, and after I quit I started seeing a lot more deer.I think there are 2 factors to account for that,less smell,and less movement on stand.
Posted by pup (Member # 90) on May 10, 2003, 11:27 AM:
I was very skeptical of ladders, I made what I call a coyote pod out of tubing, put a swivel seat on it. I made one for OK257, also. He shot one out of his, jury is still out for me. He said she never had a clue. It has its place though, especially in tall grass or weeds etc.
later pup
Posted by Bryan J (Member # 106) on May 10, 2003, 05:09 PM:
Seldom, I shared your preconception of the Arizona landscape until I got the opportunity to actually hunt down there. My buddy and I selected areas that had a little contour to them from a map, thinking we would need the contour for concealment. Turned out we called in brush that was taller than we are. We didn’t have to worry about hiding the truck. We killed the majority of our coyotes with shotguns. When things went down the action was fast. In most cases we didn’t see the coyote until it was already within shotgun range. That is a big contrast from some areas in Nevada or Utah that the brush is only ankle high. The cover is there it just isn’t the same shade of GREEN you might be used to. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Misting with Marlboro…..interesting, I have always used it as a cover scent but never thought about misting with it.
A portable tree-stand, I can see where that could open up a few areas for calling. I haven’t tried it. Something to consider though.
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 10, 2003, 05:32 PM:
Thanks for the info,that's why I joined these forums,to learn.
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 11, 2003, 10:24 AM:
I have considered a portable treestand but I think it would be hard to clunk my way up a tree with it, and not have the coyotes bust me... I'd have to only sit on that stand all day, after having pre-set the stand like deer hunters do.
We may have to do that, at the place where the coyotes steal the cats and lure the dogs away, but I think it'd be difficult to use in a drive, walk, set-up, walk back to truck, and drive scenario.
Perhaps a set of semi permenant tree stands, along a ridgetop road might be a good idea.
I recently saw a set of tree stands made from a sheet of plywood cut in half and then into triangles.
I'll work on getting a drawing done, or better yet do a search on treestands, and see what I can come up with.
Jeff 
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 11, 2003, 10:45 AM:
hey krusty,you have hotmail e-mail,have you checked it yet,I've been waiting on an answer about our trade ?
Posted by WolverineAtWork (Member # 23) on May 14, 2003, 08:36 AM:
I certainly wouldn't call myself an expert when it comes to hunting from a ladder. Everything I know about it I learned from Robb/Scottsdale.
I have found it to be a great asset in the environment I hunt. I don't often get the chance to travel too far to hunt, so I end up hunting just outside populated areas. The best coyote densities are in those areas that are too thick w/ brush for people to ATV or hunt anything else in.
The ladder opens up a great deal of possibilities that would otherwise go unexploited.
As far as how I perch, it depends on what my background is. If I've got a nice tall mesquite to back up against, I'll sit right up on top. I'm not too worried about falling as I jump up and down on the bottom rungs before climbing, and I straddle the seat so I can pivot to track a coyote from any direction as well as make sure my feet are under me if the sand gives out. Hasn't been a problem so far.
Being on a ladder makes for some interesting reactions from coyotes though. Robb and I had two charge in w/ reckless abandon, the latter of the two figured out something was wrong when he was under Robb's ladder.
The one in this pic just sat there and watched me as I climbed back up the ladder and shot him in the head @80 yds. I had already gotten down after the stand when I saw him.
It gives you an idea of the brush and cactus I call in.
[ May 14, 2003, 08:38 AM: Message edited by: WolverineAtWork ]
Posted by catskin (Member # 51) on May 14, 2003, 11:46 AM:
WolverineAtWork, were you sitting on the ladder right there like it's setup in the photo?
That would give me the same feeling as going to a highschool dance with my fly open
[ May 14, 2003, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: catskin ]
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 15, 2003, 07:44 AM:
We've always had a fun time talking about camo for predator hunting.I have always said and continue to believe CAMO is very overrated.A way for companies to make a buck.Although they make quite a fashion statement,I think you will do just fine without it.The extent of my camo is blue jeans,and either a carhart jacket,or my old woodland,or desert camo military coats,that's it and the coyotes don't seem to mind one bit.They just keep comin in.So if ya want to look cool that's one thing but to say you will call up more animals because you have the best camo, I don't buy it. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
GOOD HUNTING CO
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 15, 2003, 08:14 AM:
Yeah, but. Chad, camo is a thing that really doesn't matter, if it gives the hunter confidence. Matter of fact, most of the time, I just throwon a M60 field jacket, myself. The coyote never sees the blue jeans.
Camo flashlights and underwear are for the hardcore.
Point being: discussing the finer points of predator hunting relies on opinion more than necessity. I leave the advice to others, I only state my personal opinion on the subject and leave it at that.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 15, 2003, 08:31 AM:
Guess I'm just more confident with cammo,and I think that makes a big difference,the amount of confidence you have in yourself and your weapon on a given day.
Ever get up to go hunting,hit the woods,and immediately it comes to you that that particular day is going to be a good day,before you've seen anything yet,and it turns out to be a great day ? I think a lot of that is just a high confidence level for that day.
I honestly think cammo makes a big difference in duck hunting, most likely because those ducks have a top down view. I have learned over the years that turkeys and deer are more alert to movement than anything else.Still,I feel better using cammo,generally I do.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 15, 2003, 09:21 AM:
To clarify, there are those items that will help, those that will hurt and those that don't matter a whole lot....depending.
Help:
good stand selection, good area, accurate rifle, etc.
Hurt:
movement, smoking, noise, etc.
Don't matter:
style of dress, all things being equal, caliber, type of call.
Depending:
brand of camo, and how you use it.
I think that camo, while calling from a ladder, is more advantagous than when sitting in front of a bush.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 15, 2003, 09:30 AM:
yeah,I've seen some really bad cammo,as far as brands and styles go.
Never have called at all yet,much less from a ladder,but when I'm wearing cammo I try to put something behind me,like a bush or a tree,to break up the pattern further, and to keep me from standing out. That's what I like about my mossy oak ghillie suit,it really breaks up my outline.
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 15, 2003, 11:19 AM:
OK I didn't come up with anything in my search for treestand plans... so I decided to draw up this crude picture for the ones I saw when we were bear scouting...
It appeared they were made from 1/4 sheet triangles of 5/8" plywood... and screwed to the tree (I assume so they can be taken down and/or moved).
A series of these stands spread over a rigdetop, with clearcuts along it, might be a great way to go.
I hope this helps,
Jeff
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 15, 2003, 11:28 AM:
pup,could you post the plans for that coyote pod,how portable is it,is it too big to hump into the bush with ?
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 15, 2003, 11:30 AM:
dang,must have some fat fingers,I'm always double postin seems like.
[ May 15, 2003, 11:31 AM: Message edited by: Seldom Ever ]
Posted by Purple220 (Member # 173) on May 15, 2003, 11:38 AM:
All this stuff about needing so much camo gets me to laughing. I'm kind of like Leonard, maybe a camo hat,usually just tan colored, camo jacket or a dull colored shirt but don't forget the Wranglers. Don't know about you Leonard but I call em in close, sometimes within feet, and kill 40+ a year. Camo can be over rated at times. Smart setups kill yotes. Look at some of the guns I am using, all SS shiney stuff and a purple and white Swift. Some hunters will freak out at my equipment. I have the pics and carcases to back up my techniques.
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 15, 2003, 11:44 AM:
Yeah,I see your point P220,but like I said,I think it's a confidence builder,especially if you've been using it for a long time.It's not that it's needed,it's what I'm used to doing.I'm not saying I can't kill anything or do any good without wearing it,I'm saying I feel better when I am wearing it. Just like the fur lined jock strap I use to support my steel cajone's and keep'em from clankin' when I walk,it makes me feel better !!
I guess movement and smell are the two biggies that get you busted by just about anything that walks or crawls, wouldn't you say ?
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 16, 2003, 06:56 AM:
I guess for me as with most people, as the years go by we evolve as hunters.You see what works and what doesn't.Things that really matter and things that don't.I have really simplified my calling in say the last 7 or 8 years.Like I said I really haven't seen where camo has made the difference between success and failure in calling,so if I don't have to get all dressed up in matching camo I don't.Wranglers,or carhart pants and either a tee shirt or long sleeve shirt is fine.Then like I said when I get to my stand I will throw on a tan carhart coat or my military coat.If I felt I was handicapping myself and costing myself coyotes I would take a look and some other types of camo and wear it from head to toe.But like some have mentioned I have had alot of coyotes 20 yards from me and I truly believe they could have come closer but I shot them first. The key to being successful whether you wear camo or not is MOVEMENT(lack of it).I also agree that you need to sit in front of a tree or bush,or if there is not much cover and it is possible, call from the prone position.GOOD HUNTING CO
[ May 16, 2003, 08:56 AM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 16, 2003, 12:06 PM:
I see that most of you don't feel the need for cammo,so let me try to explain it from my point of view,in a different manner.
It's not just a confidence builder here, we pretty much need it as well.Here everything is green and thick.In winter it's still green,lots more brown,and still thick.You can't hardly move an inch,without something tryin to grab you and hold you there.Seems like most everything in West Virginia has a thorn on it too! Anyhow,a lot of the animals you encounter here,you encounter at very close distances,real sudden like. By close,I mean within or under 100 yards.I know you guys have killed stuff that did the same thing,but here's the difference.The animals we hunt here,could creep up on us while we're sitting still [?,again movement plays a part,everybody has to scratch there ass or yawn once in awhile]and watch us,without us ever knowing it. They have all the advantages, simply because it's so thick. I've seen it too many times deer hunting and turkey hunting.I think the only thing that saved our hides was being cammoed out,and blending in real good in the thickets.Had we had on normal clothes in all that green, we'd have stood out like teets on a boar hog. Now I can't say that about predator hunting/calling here,because I haven't done it yet. The circumstances will be closer to what you guys are used to as well,in that I'll try to be hunting more open areas,clear cuts and such.
One more thing,here it's not a good idea to wear brown duck hunting,the hunting is so close,some idiot that is full of the buck augers and trigger happy,might kill you thinking you're a buck.
And that brings us to another reason many of us wear cammo,to hide from other hunters and let them go by.I have let them walk by many times.The only time I make them aware of my prescence is if they get really close and I feel it's a bigger danger to me not to.
I've scared some people pretty bad from a treestand a time or two.
[ May 16, 2003, 12:07 PM: Message edited by: Seldom Ever ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 16, 2003, 03:43 PM:
SE, don't let us discourage you from wearing your camo, if that's what you want to do. I'm not against it. I'm sort of casual about it, but I'm not making any recommendation that others should be of the same mind. There are a lot of optional things, and that's one of them.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 16, 2003, 04:01 PM:
Thanks Leonard,no one is actually discouraging me,and I see the point everyone is making regarding there use of it. I'm just trying to explain,probably badly,that under the right circumstances and in the right place,it can be really helpful as well.Here it is an asset.
In a way,duck brown cloth in a desert setting,is a type of cammo.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 18, 2003, 11:54 AM:
SE,I don't want to discourage anyone from buying or using camo.I just simply believe for the most part it is overrated.20 years ago there weren't hardly any camo's on the market,except military and a couple others.So alot of VERY good hunters didn't have the ADVANTAGE of the modern camo's we have today,but still managed to have alot of success.As far as people seeing me in the field goes,I guess thats the advantage of hunting out west,When I go calling I rarely see a truck let alone another person. I have really simplified my calling over the last few years,I wear jeans,and a jacket,carry my gun with 5 or 6 bullets in my pocket,my howler,a open reed distress call and shootin sticks that's about it.Like Jay N. said in another post "those coyotes can weigh 180 lbs when you're carrying them back to the truck".So I try to go as light as possible. GOOD HUNTING CO
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 18, 2003, 12:25 PM:
Well,neither you or anyone else has discouraged me from using it, so don't worry . I think a lot of it has to do with the terrain we are in and the amount of cover.While I agree with your analogy regarding hunters of 20 years ago, I have seen a few instances where cammo saved the day,especially while bowhunting and turkey hunting. 20 years ago the rifles didn't perform nearly as well as they do today,and yet I don't see very many opting to coyote hunt with old rifles of minimal performance.Same thing goes for scopes, there was a time when it was all iron sights, but you rarely hear of anyone hunting yotes or PD's or buffalo or deer at long range with a 45-70 sharps and the old style windage and elevation sights.It all boils down to a matter of preferences,habits,and regional customs,really.
You grew up hunting in brown duck [??],I grew up hunting in cammo.
As far as gadgets go,I used to be the worlds worst,but I have calmed down a lot .Anything I buy now usually serves a real purpose,is not a gimmick but an asset,and 95% of the time it's something that makes me feel more comfortable physically.I am no spring chicken,but I'm not dead yet either.I enjoy padded seats,lots of pockets,a backrest,etc.I have worked hard living to be 51,and I feel I've earned the right to be comfortable afield,if I can afford it.It keeps my poor ol' bones from aching so much when I get back in camp. We can carry it a whole lot further as far as gadgets go and start talking about trucks,lights, high-chairs in the backs of the trucks,and hunting at night?
It's all a matter of preferences,and what each of us grew up with and became comfortable with.Whether we wish to admit it or not, we are all in large part a product of our environment.
This is all meant as discussion,not argument,and isn't meant to inflame anyone.I truly appreciate all the advice and input,I can't imagine how long it would have taken me to accumulate the predator hunting knowledge I have so far, through trial and error instead of these forums.
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on May 18, 2003, 03:47 PM:
A couple of weeks ago, LKVL, a trapper from Mn. visited and was watching some video I'd shot which included some animals jumping on me and running into me then standing a few feet away with it's hackles up, looking at me like I owed it money and the first thing he asked was "What the heck kind of camo do you wear?" I wouldn't get most of the best video I shoot without very good and complete camo.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 18, 2003, 04:14 PM:
Yes, of course. We all know that using your howler and distress sounds from under a tarp allows you some singular opportunities. We admit that camo, at any level, can be beneficial. I have seen behavior on your video that, frankly, I have not observed before.
But, I'm just talking about killing coyotes, not entertaining them. I have a large military 3D leafy camo, and it conceals as well as anything. When I use a machine, set away from my location, and the animal is focused on the sound, my use of camouflage (a french word) seems of secondary importance to remaining still.
Either way, camo is not a negative, and in the case of Master Higgins, a distinct advantage... for his particular purpose.
Good hunting. LB
PS, when I join you, (shortly) are we filming, or killing, or filming killing?
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on May 18, 2003, 04:26 PM:
Len, I'll be filming, but since it's with you I know it will be a snuff flick.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 18, 2003, 05:56 PM:
Rich,I definitely see your point,as far as keeping them close enough to pet,like you do. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
I see the advantage of camo.But I'm like Leonard,if I can get them close enough to kill that's my objective.And movement(lack of)is the big key to that.SE,As far as rifles go,I still like to shoot my 25 year old 22-250 sometimes and it still accounts for quite a few coyotes each year. GOOD HUNTING CO
[ May 18, 2003, 05:58 PM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 18, 2003, 06:10 PM:
Can't argue with how old your 22-250 is UT, and wouldn't if I could But I'm sure you know what I meant. Looks like we both agree that you don't feel you need cammo,but I do. That's what makes this country so great.Keep on sharing your yote hunting knowledge with me UT,as I said I'm a novice,and I truly do appreciate all the help from everyone of you guys.
What kind of scope have you got on that 25 year old 22-250,that was my point as well ?
Posted by Rich Higgins (Member # 3) on May 18, 2003, 06:25 PM:
Chad, if I were fur hunting I wouldn't worry much about camo either. Ever see the old photos of the early Calif. and Az. hunters wearing their cowboy shirts and white Stetsons on stand?
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 18, 2003, 06:47 PM:
One thing that all of you have really reinforced in me is the fact that I can't move on stand.I already knew it,but I have a tendency to forget, this time I think I'll remember it, and I thank you for it.
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 18, 2003, 07:25 PM:
SE,I have an OLD Redfield 6x18 scope,it has alot of scrapes and scratches but still clear as ever.
Rich,yeah I have seen alot of those old photo's,they usually have 15 or 20 coyote tails in the pictures to. GOOD HUNTING CO
[ May 18, 2003, 07:26 PM: Message edited by: UTcaller ]
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 18, 2003, 07:28 PM:
Dang,you must've been around awhile yourself UT,bet you've got some tales to tell,eh ?
Thanks for sharing.
Posted by NASA (Member # 177) on May 18, 2003, 08:46 PM:
OK Rich. I've got a spot on the shelf reserved for your next volume. Don't forget me, alright?
Posted by UTcaller (Member # 8) on May 18, 2003, 08:55 PM:
No,I'm not that old,just got the gun and scope when I was pretty young.I have had some pretty interesting experiences hunting coyotes,but I think anyone who has hunted coyotes for awhile will say the same thing.Maybe that's why most hunters think we're all an odd bunch. I will say one thing about hunting coyotes, they will sure keep you on your toes.My coyote motto is "always expect the unexpected." ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
GOOD HUNTING CO
Posted by pup (Member # 90) on May 19, 2003, 06:32 AM:
Why not use it if you can afford it? We have enough disadvantages without adding to the list. While not absolutely necessary, it does help, especially when they are close. Kinda falls into the category with the mist. Besides that there are all those cool pockets.
later pup
Seldom ever, if I get some time this afternoon, I will get some pics up so you can see. I like my pod as far as the ladders go. Not as light as the wood ladders, but alot sturdier and I can film and shoot, 360 degrees with a backrest.
[ May 19, 2003, 06:36 AM: Message edited by: pup ]
Posted by pup (Member # 90) on May 19, 2003, 03:03 PM:
We normally use these in tall grass pastures, set up as you see here with a little breakup.
the overall weight is around 25lbs. very stable when up. We use them alot , as they have allowed us to hunt in places where rises or tall grass kept us from it in the past. I have yet to shoot one out of the pod yet, but pard has killed a couple.
later pup
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 19, 2003, 05:25 PM:
Wow,those are really nice,thanks for the pics! I could use one of those on the river bottom locally!
Posted by pup (Member # 90) on May 21, 2003, 06:43 AM:
thanks,Seldom Ever
I used 1 1/4 tubing, swivels from boat seats. I used a chain for the bracing on mine, it was easier to put on than the solid bracing that I put on my buddy's. Height to seat is 6'6". We have packed them in several places, I wouldn't want to haul it more than a 1/2 mile. but anything under that it is okay.
You mentioned bottoms and that is one of the reasons that I built these. we have some spots that you just can't call without them, the growth is so tall.
If you want to build one drop me a line and I will get you my phone number. I get the tape out and give you the dimensions.
later pup
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 21, 2003, 01:26 PM:
I might be giving you a shout come closer to hunting season,maybe August or September.Wonder if those could be made out of schedule 40 pipe ?
Posted by pup (Member # 90) on May 21, 2003, 02:04 PM:
yeah as long as you are the one carrying it. lol.. I don't intend to haul three 7.5' sticks of schedule 40 anywhere.
I already look like a pack mule now. camera gun mist butt cushion sticks.
should be sturdy though.
later pup
Posted by Seldom Ever (Member # 185) on May 21, 2003, 02:30 PM:
I was thinking 3 foot pieces of 2 inch SCH40,joined together with couplers when needed.You could carry the whole thing in a back pack if you did it right.
Posted by howler (Member # 197) on May 21, 2003, 08:04 PM:
I just wanted to make a little comment about the treestand that screwed to the tree, These really aren't recommended becasue the screws have a tendacy to work loose by wind swaying tree, and if it sits for a month or so or a few weeks-well
it might give way
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 22, 2003, 10:23 AM:
Howler,
While disagreement hasn't gone well for me here lately... I am going to still have to disagree anyway.
Not to be argumentative... just to calculate all the risks (my risk calculator has a few more numbers on it than the average guy's).
I have not used that type of stand, but the one I found in the woods was more than a year old (an educated guess), and it was still plenty sturdy.
I have a "practice tree" in my yard (for climbing) and it has ten stainless steel bolts and hangers installed in it... (Stainless hardware would be the obvious choice, to me, for a treestand too)
Like these:
I first worried about them working loose over time or with repeated bodyweighting of the lag bolts holding them to the tree.
This has not been the case, a tree grows larger from the outside layer... this has made each placement tighter and less prone to falling out, in fact the tree has grown a lot tighter around the threads and removing them at all will be quite difficult.
Yes, some caution when leaving the ground is always a good idea... gravity is a cruel mistress... and you cannot escape her... if she gets her grips on you, you'll be sorry!
Treestands kill or injure about as many hunters as guns do (I'd bet) look at the safety improvements they've had to make... harnesses, safety straps, railings etc.
Anyone who goes up... must come down.
Try to do it in a manner that won't include a Dr.s visit.
Jeff
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 22, 2003, 01:17 PM:
Krusty, don't sweat it, you make good contributions. We sure as heck needn't fear disagreement.
A pet peeve of mine is the person that believes he is more informed on every issue, when it is conceded that he is expert in one area.
I work with a guy that knows more computer application than I ever will know, or want to know, and I admit it.
He also thinks he knows more about politics, guns, human interaction, etc. And that's
open for discussion.
I nicknamed him "Sal 9000". He liked it so much, I later guessed
it was the password he was using, and I was right! Twice, slightly modified!
Oh well, don't despair. Good luck on the job search, too!
Good hunting. LB
edit: spelling
[ May 22, 2003, 01:18 PM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 22, 2003, 03:39 PM:
Thanks Leonard,
I try to post in a positive manner, it's just good internet manners.
I actually don't fear much, definitely not a disagreement... I just have been too busy with my fledgling call making business for my usual longwinded debates, and I have had some really persistant, and unlikely foes lately. lol It looked like that might be the way this could go.
I try not to come off as an expert about everything, I have a lot to learn about most I think.
As an arborist, a contractor, and a climber I felt qualified in at least this area...
Howlers advise to use this type of attachment to a tree with caution is well founded and well taken by me.
I will agree that no stand should be attched to more than one trunk or more than one tree... trees create incredible dynamic forces with even just a small amount of wind.
I don't know where this job search thing has come from... but I appreciate any luck I can get.
I am gainfully self employed, in this Bush economy many people are having trouble making ends meet... I am one of them, as are many of the clients I work for. This has stressed me to the limits financially.
But I am not searching for work anymore than any other person in my line of work.
I shoulda been an ant... instead of a grasshopper.
Jeff
Posted by Terry Hunter (Member # 58) on May 22, 2003, 03:49 PM:
I have not tried the ladder its to heavy and I travel light.I have shot a few coyotes from deer stands,tractors and bulldozers.After a tractor has set in the pasture a few days coyotes pay little notice of it.
Posted by Krustyklimber (Member # 72) on May 22, 2003, 04:12 PM:
Terry,
That is funny about the bulldozer, I wonder if the animals see it as a friend... it makes good trails!
My brothers favorite elk story is of the logger who everyday drove past the same clearing and watched a huge bull elk gather a harem... on opening day he drove up and without stopping the bulldozer shot the huge bull!
Then he picked it up with the blade and carried it to the barn!
Gotta love that! The woodsman and his prize...
Jeff
Posted by onecoyote (Member # 129) on June 08, 2003, 01:10 PM:
Yep, I agree 100% Leonard. Just to think we went to the same high school together. You must have taken that same Predator calling class lol. Just think about it, three guys from the same school about the same time. All three competed against each other in state predator hunting championships for years and years, never knowing we all went to the same school together. Kinda hard to believe but it's true. I wonder how many coyotes, bobcats, gray fox and badgers bit the dust at the hands of the old El Monte boys?
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on June 08, 2003, 01:28 PM:
What, you never killed a lion?
Posted by onecoyote (Member # 129) on June 09, 2003, 09:30 AM:
Not in California lol.
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