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Author
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Topic: Best AR platform for predators?
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted September 07, 2008 10:38 AM
Just for fun after I sighted in the 52gr Amax loads in the 223 and checked zero on the 204 and 25WSSM uppers, I thought it would be fun to shoot a shot from each upper and see what kind of group I could get.
Turned out way better than I thought as the 52gr Amax didn’t group that well when sighting in.
I know it was luck and I probably can’t do it again, but it adds to the COOL factor for sure.
Here is a pic of my high dollar shooting setup.
Folding picnic table form Wallyworld and two 50 cent sand bags from Lowes.
Close up of the target
edit to say - got to love that duct tape cigar holder...
[ September 07, 2008, 12:40 PM: Message edited by: Kelly Jackson ]
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted September 07, 2008 11:14 AM
Good eye Leonard. Yep its a 1903-A3 springfield.
I picked the gun up at a gun show many years ago for 225.00.. Its not a Remmy but it sure shoots..
Kelly good group with the 52 gr. A-max's.. Set up some targets a little farther out and compare them to the other bullets you have used.. I'm pretty sure the A-maxs will do the best farther out..
I use them in my Ackley and they group really well at 4-700 yds..
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5064 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted September 07, 2008 11:30 AM
Tim – I got to work on the 52gr Amax. I shot five 5 shot groups and never got it under a ¾” group.
The pic above is where I fired one shot from the 233 upper with a 52gr Amax.
Pushed two pins to changed uppers and fired one shot from the 204 upper with a 35gr Berger.
Changed uppers again and fired one shot from the 25WSSM with a 85gr NBT
I will try the Amax on out to 300 before long.
[ September 07, 2008, 11:32 AM: Message edited by: Kelly Jackson ]
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted September 07, 2008 12:00 PM
I just modified the 17 ca. forum for all you AR folks to discuss your favorite "upper".
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31462 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted September 07, 2008 12:43 PM
Hehehheehe...
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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Dan Carey
unknown comic
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posted September 07, 2008 12:51 PM
You might have more response if the membership was allowed to post in it. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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stevecriner
UNKNOWN-before he was famous?
Member # 892
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posted September 07, 2008 01:36 PM
Here is a hundred yard group from my 22-250 Ackley Dan built me. Man it is a shooter. I traded it for a Kimber ultra carry II .45 the other night and some boot. Ill bring my kimber and a box of shells so Vic can have a shootin fit at the campout. I brought a ruger 44 I had last year and Vic was bouncing pop cans with it so Im sure he will like this one.
3 shots 100yrds
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"I love coyotes and put up with dogs....My neighbor has a slew of them."
Posts: 321 | From: missouri | Registered: Jul 2006
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CrossJ
SECOND PLACE: PAUL RYAN Look-a-like contest
Member # 884
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posted September 07, 2008 04:05 PM
Kelly, I am having a hard time following the significance of the three shots. It would appear to me you are shooting three different rifles; all sighted in 1" high at 100 yds. You have three different scopes sitting on top of three different bores. All you have done is swapped out the trigger assembly. I have three different bolt guns that would produce the same group.
Just an observasion.
Maintain
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A friend will help you move. A good friend will help you move a body.
Posts: 1025 | From: on a water tower | Registered: Jul 2006
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted September 07, 2008 04:51 PM
You are right G. I guess if there is a point it would be that AR's can shoot and not everyone that shoots them are spray and pray types.
Like I said I just wanted to see how a 3 shot gorup from three different bores would be. Never done it before - with a bolt or an AR.
It turned out pretty good and I thought it was interesting.
Catch you later
Kelly
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted September 07, 2008 06:53 PM
anyone make up the rules yet ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
I am heading you way in about three week and need to know what to expect ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted September 07, 2008 07:13 PM
George,
You can expect more fun than the law should allow. Lots of great company, you will love it!
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted September 07, 2008 07:44 PM
I hear yea pal ,,
truthfully,, I am really all about fun.. that's why I am going to have fun ,no matter what it looks like on here
I am coming for a good time. meet and leave with a lot new friends
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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Aznative
FARTS ON CLUELESS LIBERALS
Member # 506
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posted September 08, 2008 09:09 AM
Sorry about jumping on this thread so late, but I usually just go straight to the political forums being the season of politics. To answer Cranky Farmers question, I believe an ar10 in 243 would be the best caliber for predators. It is a little overkill for coyotes especially if you wish to save the pelts. However, it would quickly dispatch coyotes even with marginal shots that an AR15 would let run away wounded. It also would be nice to have this caliber if one was to ever call in a cougar.
I recently bought an Armalite AR10 in 308. My logic to go with Armalite over DPMS was the magazine issue. Armalite's can use M1A magazines with a minor modification that one could do themselves. From my understanding the DPMS magazine is proprietary. If Remington had announced the R25, I would have probably gone with that platform because they are offering 243 as a standard caliber.
Unlike most AR15s, the issue with the AR10s is there is no milspec standard for them. What this means is that you cannot put a DPMS upper on an Armalite lower and visa versa.
AR10s are expensive. If Cranky Farmer's question is limited to the AR15s, I would go with the ole venerable .223. Bullets are cheap, and this round has ample killing power well beyond 200 yards for coyotes provided the shooter does he job and places the shot in the boiler room. If I was going to go to another caliber, I would go with the Ackley improved.
To jump on the issue about the viability of ARs, I love em. I use to be a traditional gun type of person. I strictly use bolt guns for deer, elk and antelope. For coyote hunting I wanted something that could provide a quick second shot. I use to use a HK 630 which is a semi automatic sporting model that HK made about 20 years ago. It worked well enough, but they have become quit valuable over there original asking price. Being that parts are becoming limited, I've decided to retire that gun to the status of a non shooter. I'll save it and sell it when I need to buy my next pickup truck.
I decided to go to the black gun for several reasons. First there is a milspec standard for the ar15 which will mean this gun can be maintained for the next two centuries. Repair parts area plentiful. Second, a friend of mine documented his kills which were numerous. He found the average shot distance was 85 yards. The AR is more than accurate for that range and much more. It also is good in thicker cover situations that would normally be best handled with a shotgun. I'm not saying I never use a shot gun. What I'm saying is if the stand is questionable about the density of cover, I'll grab the AR.
When you get those rare stands that call in two or more coyotes at a time, the Ar is the best thing since sliced bread. It is like shooting at four legged quail.
With the above said, I feel one needs to consider there hunting situations:
If you hunt in the wide open grass lands, a bolt gun is probably the way to go.
If you are not allowed to have a loaded weapon in your car, I probably wouldn't have an AR. I don't like racking the action at the stand. In Az we can rackem and leave the gun hot all day long while driving from stand to stand. Many states don't permit this. Also, the people you hunt with become very important when doing this. You and your partners must be VERY MUZZLE CONSIOUS. I had to twice cross a border patrol check point this last weekend down by Tombstone. I was down there doing a little calling(five stands in two days), and a bunch of scouting for my deer hunt coming up in two months. I crossed both times with a loaded ar in the cab with me. Never had any problems, and I did keep my hands in view. Saw only one coyote about five hundred yards out.
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Never thought the devil would need a teleprompter but I could be wrong.
United State of America: RIP
Born July 4th 1776 died November 6th 2012
Posts: 1924 | From: Phoenix Az | Registered: Jan 2005
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Q-Wagoner
FREE TRIAL MEMBERSHIP
Member # 33
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posted September 08, 2008 05:15 PM
Ok, if the contestants can consistently hit a stationary coyote sized target at 40 yards at the camp out then we need a tiebreaker right? LOL George and his partner Vs. Randy and his. At the end of the season we will see who kills the most predators.
Sounds fair to me? LOL
Good hunting.
Q,
Posts: 617 | From: Nebraska | Registered: Jan 2003
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted September 08, 2008 06:50 PM
Yea,,what ever, if that's what yea need Q,,,lol
Edited to add ,,
oh i see, you must be his partner,
[ September 08, 2008, 07:06 PM: Message edited by: George Ackley ]
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted September 08, 2008 07:07 PM
quote:
When you get those rare stands that call in two or more coyotes at a time, the Ar is the best thing since sliced bread. It is like shooting at four legged quail.
I normaly call alone and that is the very reason i bought my AR. for multiable coyotes.. My AR was chambered in the 223 cartridge and through trial and error i found that the 223 was'nt good enough for more than one coyote comeing in or takeing a second shot after a miss. The bullet is to slow and drops to fast compared to the bolt guns i use.. I found that with a little more practice i could connect on doubles and even get the coyote after i missed on the first shot..
My AR is gone now and i don't miss it at all... ![[Cool]](cool.gif)
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5064 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted September 08, 2008 07:34 PM
Dang TA, did you put any powder in those cases or were you just using the primer to send the bullet out the tube?
I'm not a good long range shot, in fact this was one of my longest shots about 250 yards. I was back in the trees across the fence. While not an AR it was a 223, maybe I'm just lucky? I do miss that Sako FWIW.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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stevecriner
UNKNOWN-before he was famous?
Member # 892
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posted September 08, 2008 08:23 PM
quote:
Although I like my AR's I have a feeling Randy knows how to use his sniper gun way out there and up close.
This was said in the beer money thread..... this is the point...Why limit yourself with a short barreled Unlikely to hit it anything way out gun when you could have one that does both. I would hate to limit myself.
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"I love coyotes and put up with dogs....My neighbor has a slew of them."
Posts: 321 | From: missouri | Registered: Jul 2006
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted September 08, 2008 09:09 PM
,
You ask,why?
The one reason for me is because of my disease, I have a hard time handling a full size rifle,
when I was going though bad time with my hand and joints I was given my first 16'' AR by a friend and call maker that was seeing the hard time I was having getting around. once I got the AR it was now a new world for me because how easy it was to carry , handle and shoot. Me not having to work the bolt was half the battle.. I been around the calling game for awhile before I got sick. with a AR I feel I kill as many critters as I ever did with my bolts.
No maybe I don't throw lead 300 and 400 yards but again its about the calling to me, I rather try and work them close and not kill them then shoot at them 300 yards.
I under stand some of you have live stock and predation concern's ,, witch is cool,,, kill them however you need to .. I like seeing dead coyote piled up as much as the next guy..
But where I do most of my hunting I don't have them concern's,At the end of each calling day, I don't need to kill anything,,,,
that's one reason why I don't use a electronic call,, if I don't have to, its all about calling them close before I will bust a primer ...I never said the AR platform is more accurate then a bolt,
I just said that they are accurate, and more then enough efficient for killing coyotes , and because they are light and fast on the secant shot i think they are the perfect calling gun..
the bottom line I guess was that the guy who stated the thread ask a question,, and the then the guys started in with there thought that we (us ar users ) only use them because they are cool looking gun..
I will be there with my 16'' AR looking to be shown how much more a bolt is better in killing coyote at a reasonable distance... I know everyone is out for a good time , And i ant taken any of this to hart, I am also just out to have a good time like the rest of yea
[ September 08, 2008, 09:17 PM: Message edited by: George Ackley ]
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted September 08, 2008 09:32 PM
It's not the gun that limits me...
I've had my share of heavy barreled rifles and for the missed opportunities that I've had with my light weight pea shooters, it just doesn't make sense to carry the extra weight and burn more powder so I can shoot a coyote at 50 yards.
Let me clarify a little, 2 of my AR's weigh 9 pounds, that's not light weight by any means and I can carry more weight than most. I just prefer light rifles, AR's or bolt guns. Even my bigfoot gun is a Sako Finnlite in 300 WSM, it weighs 8.3 pounds.
I will likely aquire another long range critter squasher and ya'll can say I told you so. A buddy of mine has been banging steel at 1000 yards and it sounds fun. I'm even playing with 77 grain bullets and turrets. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
But for my calling entertainment, I prefer to use a light weight AR-15. I tend to get a little further from the truck than some. The Antlers contest you and Randy were in, I missed check in because we were about 4 miles from the truck and only had 1 coyote and a cat. I would've liked to have met both of you (although I didn't know you were there until later) we decided to hunt till dark or until we reached the property line, despite the high wind, rain and snow flurries. Hunting is something I enjoy, I don't make a living as a fur hunter (I'd starve to death) and have never felt undergunned with a .223 be it in an AR or bolt gun. Just my choice.
Besides picking the "best" for someone else, rarely ever works out.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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stevecriner
UNKNOWN-before he was famous?
Member # 892
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posted September 09, 2008 03:50 PM
George, Im sorry I didnt realize the disease. With all the predator talk,night hunting and highracks I didnt realize you had one,Im sorry friend.
"unknown"
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"I love coyotes and put up with dogs....My neighbor has a slew of them."
Posts: 321 | From: missouri | Registered: Jul 2006
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted September 09, 2008 04:23 PM
I went from using my Remington varmint special to my Winchester feather to the AR .
Steve,
when you ask why limit yourself
I was just saying what made me pick up the AR is all.
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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stevecriner
UNKNOWN-before he was famous?
Member # 892
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posted September 09, 2008 05:36 PM
Okey DOkey.
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"I love coyotes and put up with dogs....My neighbor has a slew of them."
Posts: 321 | From: missouri | Registered: Jul 2006
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Pilgrim on Earth
Knows what it's all about
Member # 314
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posted October 03, 2008 05:16 AM
(I thought maybe this fit here instead of hijacking two-tails' thread about Les).
Even though I don't give half-a-hoot about who thinks what about such-n-such a rifle...I must admit that of the AR15 discussions/comments, the entertainment quotient alone elevates its worth to me.
quote:
In the case of a guy wanting to weild one of those black plastic bullet delivery systems or an auto blunderbuss, I for sure don't want them sitting anywhere near me, hot brass or hulls flying in or near my face pisses me off!
Ok, so now AR15's are plastic and evidently throw piles of hot brass in all directions? You anti-AR guys are better at spin than the lib media.
Posts: 54 | From: Indiana | Registered: Feb 2004
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Kelly Jackson
SECOND PLACE/GARTH BROOKS LOOK-A-LIKE CONTEST
Member # 977
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posted October 03, 2008 07:05 AM
I don't know Pilgrim. I like AR's but on alot of them the stock and handguard are plastic.
I also make sure I am not sitting too close.
All it takes is once for a piece of hot brass to go down your collar from a partners AR and you will take notice.
I don't get to night hunt alot, but if I did. I am pretty sure I would be carrying a bolt gun for that reason.
Posts: 997 | From: Comanche OK | Registered: Oct 2006
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