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Author
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Topic: Can we have a serious discussion about shotguns for coyotes?
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 12, 2012 03:57 AM
I ran a box of trap loads through it and about 15 rounds of 2 3/4 BB'S and some 3" buckshot.
The BB's patterned the best so that what I've been useing for nite time stands when useing a lite.
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5083 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 12, 2012 06:35 AM
I have my grandson's shottie in the safe somewhere, while he's in Europe. Maybe I'll dig it out this morning? I'm pretty sure there is something weird about it, something about the design, but with so many doves, I couldn't be bothered actually looking at it, at the time?
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31478 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 12, 2012 08:47 AM
Leonard,
Embarrassed to say I hadn't read this thread or i wouldn't have been foolish enuf to suggest I may be able to help you.You've already got all the advice you need i'd say.
For craps and giggles though I'll throw this out.(As background I'll say i shot my first pheasant 61 yrs ago,shot over 200 honkers last year,and it's a rare year i don't shoot 3 cases of 'shottie' shells living here in Shottie heaven.)Here's what i tell the kids i start out with 'shotties'.I have them play 'touch the bird'for an hour or two before they shoot actual shell # one.Touch the bird is simply having them extend their dominant arm out fully and point and follow every bird that goes by.Have them keep swinging til the bird is past while concentrating their finger on the beak.The more repetitions the better.The more variety in bird size and speed the better.They quickly realize those birds are moving right along. ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
From there they graduate to doing it with an empty shottie and soon with a loaded one.(often clay ones to start)
A bit oversimplified but 'touching the bird' is the best method I've ever used.Try it on your doves.The computer between the ears can be programmed unless it's got a bad virus.
Enuf I suspect.As Bearhunter knows I did start actual testing yesterday but didn't get far.Six shots in with 3 inch 4 buck I found out the factory mod choke on my Extrema 2 had pretty much welded itself in place over the last season or two(first time ever)and it's now soaking in a cup of Sea Foam.
Sad cause i rarely get a calm day here like I had yesterday.Oh well,i only have a bunch of ammo and 4 more assorted chokes to go.I also had forgotten how brutal recoil can be when one actually snugs in and aims. ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 12, 2012 09:31 AM
Sounds reasonable, I could give it a try. As I freely admit, I am not a particularly accomplished wing shooter although I can still shoot tight groups with an accurate rifle and always could.
I have an assortment of 3½" shells and they are brutal. At least when patterning? Maybe I don't need that much for 40 yard coyotes?
Good hunting. El Bee
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31478 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted April 12, 2012 03:08 PM
DiYi;
Thanx for the tip on `touching the bird`. I'm going to give it an honest try. I suck at wing shooting.............as in, I can do about as well shooting from the hip as the shoulder. I keep trying to aim with the shottie & have little confidence in my ability. Hopefully, this will help.
Just realized; I've taken two pheasants out of the air with a bow, but have never killed one with a shotgun.
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7584 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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the bearhunter
HM PROSTAFF & MIDWEST REGIONAL GURU VOTED MOST HANDSOME MINNESOTAN
Member # 3552
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posted April 12, 2012 04:01 PM
i feel i used to be a fair wing shot. than we had to go to steel shot and everything went to shit.
i'll never forget this:. when i got a lab pup about 17 years ago, i took him out in the country when he was about 6 months old. intent was to shoot barn pigions to see how well he would fetch. i had a hodge-podge of shotshell. some 2's 4;s up to 8's. i think i had 28 rounds and knocked down a bird with each shot.i was feeling like King Shit and bragged about my shooting to all my buds. (non believed me). i than went and bought a box of 25 and went out again soon after. shot the whole box and killed 2 ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
anywho, i don't hunt birds much anymore and have'nt for about 10 years. i shoot a 30+ old 870 and for some reason, the last few years i've been short stroking it and blowing follow up shots.
i seen a Stoger semi at scheels for 329.00 used. looks to be in good shape and it fit me well. might go snatch it up if still there and than hear what DY sais about choke tubes and go from there. years ago when we had fox, i shot truck loads with copper plated BB's. not sure what effective range would be for coyotes with them.
probabaly will settle for 4 buck
Posts: 1049 | From: minnifornia | Registered: Jan 2010
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 12, 2012 04:38 PM
KoKo,
With the bow,bet you are instinctively 'touching the bird'.Your computer is calculating it,not you ' 'thinking'it by aiming. Hope it helps.
By the way,kids who learn that way almost always have a great 'follow through' as well which is a good thing.
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 14, 2012 07:03 AM
Need a few ideas if anyone has any.As mentioned I have my factory mod choke in my Berreta Extrema.After shooting my 4 buck test patterns with that(OK to about 35 yds,getting dismal rapidly beyond that)I tried to remove it without success.A first!!!
A buddy from Mpls,Mn works for the company that makes Sea Foam and on his last trip out here hunting he left me a case of it plus some 'Creep' they make that was supposed to 'creep' into and loosen anything.Long story short=after Foaming and Creeping and heating and...for days it's still stuck beyond tight.
Called him and he called his gunsmith in the Twin Cities(a Jim Kolbe I think he said)The smith said this happens fairly often with screw in chokes,it's impossible in those situations to loosen them,and I would need to secure it,then cut carefully through the choke insert and pry it out.Said obviously thats the end of that choke tube but the barrel and threading etc would be good to go IF done right.He suggested strongly a gunsmith be employed to do it.
Thoughts?Suggestions?
Heck I've never heard of this happening,not to mention hearing its 'fairly common'.
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 14, 2012 07:26 AM
DiYi; Put the barrel in the freezer for a few days and then try to screw the choke out..
If that don't work then take it to a gunsmith...
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5083 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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R.Shaw
Peanut Butter Man, da da da da DAH!
Member # 73
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posted April 14, 2012 07:53 AM
Midway sells a choke tube removal tool. Took a look at it on their site and it looks like it should do the job, but for 70 bucks it should. LOL. I have no personal experience with the device, but have talked with others and they said it works.
Personally, I see no way to remove the choke by cutting it and prying the durn thing out. How do you cut and pry without damageing threads in the barrel?
Posts: 545 | From: Nebraska | Registered: Jan 2003
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 14, 2012 08:23 AM
Thanks TA,will try it.No harm there that I can see.
R Shaw,I agree for sure.That cutting business would be my absolute last option!If nothing else,with that mod choke it's a great gun for waterfowling so may just leave it.I've got another I could try rig up for coyote use.
A very strange deal.
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 14, 2012 08:40 AM
Liquid nitrogen wouldbe the best route if you know someone that has some.. We use it alot for installing piston sleeves but you have to be dam carefull with the stuff or you could loose a finger or hand....
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5083 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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Kokopelli
SENIOR DISCOUNT & Dispenser of Sage Advice
Member # 633
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posted April 14, 2012 09:03 AM
We used to use dry ice to install bearings. Not sure how this freezing would work for un-installing something.
Think that I'll pick up a can of Anti-Seize & hit the threads on my chokes. (Assuming that mine will come out)
And what, you ask, does one do with the rest of the can of the lovely silver anti-seize??
Glad you asked; You keep it in your truck for those special dick-wads that park next to you with the mirrors overlapping or the dildos that think the Handicap Space is just for their lazy asses even though they don't have or need a Handicap Plate. Just a smear under the door handle. Silver anti-seize is no big deal to remove from your hands in the shop.......damn near impossible to remove out in public, though. And it gets on EVERYTHING. ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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And lo, the Light of the Trump shown upon the Darkness and the Darkness could not comprehend it.
Posts: 7584 | From: Under a wandering star | Registered: Apr 2005
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 14, 2012 09:53 AM
I like to use a trapping lure dumped down the heaters air intake...
For other uses of anti-seize I use it on the threads of the bolt shroud and little on the fireing pin, and just a dabb of it on the backside of the locking luggs and also on the threads of my switch barrels.. good stuff...
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
Posts: 5083 | From: S.D. | Registered: Jan 2006
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 14, 2012 10:10 AM
R.Shaw,
Found the Midway tool.Yup,$72 plus they sell just the 'tool heads' for that tool.Tells even my mind a few things:
1.Stuck chokes are in fact 'fairly common'.
2.Some are stuck so bad you may need to replace the 'head'on the tool at times.
3.Their ad says 'gunsmith required'.
All that though tells me somewhere there are Gunsmiths with tools that can solve my problem short of the 'saw' idea.I'd better look around.Would think here in SoDak many would have them since most people,trucks and homes have at least one 'shottie'.
Thanks.
Posts: 623 | From: SoDak | Registered: Feb 2011
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 14, 2012 11:07 AM
I think I would try some Kroil or a liquid wrench type of solvent.
If you were careful, you might be able to heat the threaded area with a propane torch. A barrel can take quite a bit of heat without damaging. Can't get it red, of course.
What kind of notches does your choke have? My Remington has a wrench with 4 cuts and I think it would be possible to use a small hammer on it as an impact wrench.
I suppose an ordinary "easy out" of the correct size could work, but it would damage the choke. I have one that I use on broken off ½" pipe nipples that would be just about the right size.
Good luck, LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31478 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted April 14, 2012 11:11 AM
Almost everything we work on is seized up. With things of same material and thickness try a little heat. Just don't turn it blue.
Posts: 2283 | From: okieland | Registered: Feb 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 14, 2012 11:30 AM
koko, when you buy the anti seize, and have a bunch left over, could you put some in a baggie and send it this way? I might keep it in the truck for occasional use. I might even use a bit on threads? But, this fancy choke I bought recently was very clear about degreasing the barrel threads before installation. The part that sticks out has a very positive grip area of about two inches and requires no wrench, at all.
Good hunting. El Bee
edit: also, I have to unscrew the choke on the 835 just to stack it in the safe, which I have done a number of times, already. It comes apart pretty good, so far? Mossbergs have a crummy choke wrench, BTW
[ April 14, 2012, 11:34 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31478 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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UTcaller
NEVADA NIGHT FIGHTER
Member # 8
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posted April 14, 2012 01:13 PM
I did own an Autoloader shotgun at one time a Remington 550 then I went back to my Remington 870 soon after....lol
Good Hunting Chad
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 14, 2012 02:40 PM
I don't think you want to be applying any heat to that shot-gun barrel. Heat will soften the metal and if you have a vent rib there is a good chance of disturbing the solder that holds it on as well..
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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DiYi
Wears wife's pink panties under his camo for good luck. (yeah, right!)
Member # 3785
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posted April 14, 2012 03:12 PM
Well My mech skills are very limited but just tried the hammer approach and only part of my factory choke 'wrench' survived.I'm putting the barrel in the freezer and forgetting about it for awhile. ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted April 14, 2012 05:34 PM
You should have used the Kroil first, or heat first. THEN impact.
And, I don't agree with TA, you can get away with some heat and we aren't talking about enough heat to loosen silver solder, just enough to un seize threads. Heat works wonders for seized threaded parts.
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31478 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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TA17Rem
Hello, I'm the legendary Tim Anderson, Field Marshall, Southern Minneesota Sector
Member # 794
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posted April 14, 2012 05:53 PM
Sure Leonard I agree you can get by with a little heat. The question is how much and how do you know your not over heating the metal..
I know you can use what they call Temp stick but I doubt he has any and you can't just buy the stuff anywhere...
Usually anytime you get a cartridge stuck in a chamber and it won't tap out with a rod or the bolt won't even open you can just toss it in a freezer..
Freezeing the barrel is the cheapest route to go and if it don't work no harm done.. Any of the other ways mentioned just puts him at risk of damageing something which has already happened....He is'nt set up yo do the work so he should just get someone that is.. Cheaper in the long run..
Not every gun manufacture makes a good strong choke wrench, some are plastic and cheap metal. I think I have one out of five of them that couldbe safely tapped on, the rest I'm sure would break.
At work we have even gone so far to dump Liguid nitrogen on a very large bearing or bushing and got it to come off from the shaft..
I've seen heat used as well and in most cases damage was done to something by pounding on it and sooner or later the tourch had to be used to get it off and then time had to be spent fixing up what was damaged...
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What if I told you, the left wing and right wing both belong to same bird!
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted April 14, 2012 07:25 PM
Note I said "don't turn it blue"...
The problem with freezing it is it's probably a stainless tube and thicker or at least as thick as the barrel so the barrel will shrink first.
Where as heat will expand the barrel without affecting the tube. Silver solder melts way beyond not turning it blue. The old side by side shotguns were poorly soldered with lead/tin but even they needed 300 degrees to flow so you ain't gonna hurt the metal.
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TOM64
Knows what it's all about
Member # 561
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posted April 14, 2012 07:29 PM
Heat expands, cold contracts...
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