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Author
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Topic: Question
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pup
Knows what it's all about
Member # 90
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posted July 24, 2006 09:54 AM
WOW,
Who moved the campfires to the locker-rooms?
It is impossible to compare both boards with the same yard stick.
Leonard runs this board period. He owns it and as long as HIS feelers are not hurt , he lets a thread run. IMHO, this is a place where you can argue and cuss it out. Thanks for that.
I was not welcomed with open arms here, but, was sideswiped by Wiley E. I am not for sure if I even fit in now, but TOUGH cookie, I say my piece and let it be. If ya'll don't like'em refute'em.
PM is not, PM caters to those new to the sport and kids, and strive for a family style atmosphere. It is a different campfire. PM banned me a while back. IT WAS MY FAULT, as I was carrying somebody else's cross. PM warned me that I was crossing the line, and I failed to heed the warning thinking I was in the right, and maybe I was, but PM was NOT the place to carry on that particular conversation. Quite frankly that particluar conversation belonged in the alley, face to face. But, sometimes blind people bump into things from time to time. PM has a TOS and those that post there agree to abide by that. They run a tighter ship, and if ya'll don't like it you have done the right thing and left. IF ya'll had let this lay, then nobody could of faulted you.
Both boards have their place, and are needed. Balance is a good thing.
Vic commented on how he can read people through this medium. Now that is true BULLSH*T!! This is the most piss poor excuse for communication created. IT lacks personality, tone and inflection.
Someone jumped a recreational caller for calling a spot , being "worked" by an "ADC" fella. Lots of information not being told for that situation. Again poor medium for that conversation. I am a recreational caller, and I can do "ADC" "WORK". And for the record, just because monetary gain is not in the picture, it can still be work. The consideration of a place to hunt for the removal of "problem" animals classifies it as "WORK", as per the hiring agency for Wildlife Dept. here in OK. I took my hat in my hand and approached PM to return. Remember after Pride comes the fall, and yes sometimes it lasts for the season.
Now for my beef,
I am really amazed at the bashing of a good friend by a good friend, on a public forum. Somebody pick up a Freakin phone, and privately work it out.
Byron South has worked his arse off to get where he is at. I have personally watched Byron stop a business deal to talk to a young interested caller. I know that he has spent countless hours talking to "Wannabes", that has not done anything but take his valuable time. Bryon spends the time with compassion , knowing it is part of the whole deal. I am talking about time spent that could of been spent feeding his family. Trust me if Byron wanted to promote himself, he would of done a better job than he has.
IMHO, Byron does not care to promote himself, but rather his PRODUCT. Who wouldn't? You drag a camera to every stand and you spend hours and money editing it, wouldn't you expect a return for your effort?
In my relationship with Byron, I misread an action of his at first. Not Byron's fault, but my own.
Remember a difference in opinion is just that, a difference in opinion. We all got them and they all stink.
I know better than to say "let's all get along", or "if ya don't I'm leaving", as it wouldn't change anything.
I do know that I am disappointed in the actions, of what I considered grown adults.
What is amazing is that most of us really get along well in person, unless I am mistaken or somebody is being a hypocrite.
later pup
Posts: 213 | From: Oklahoma | Registered: Feb 2003
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TheHuntedOne
Knows what it's all about
Member # 623
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posted July 24, 2006 10:08 AM
Well, a lot happened over the weekend, and like always, I couldn't step around it, I had to go and step right into it.
I need, really need, to apologize to Jack Roberts for responding to his post the way I did. And to the members of both Predator Masters and Hunt Masters for what I said. It was not constructive and all it did was serve to show my ass. Again.
I also want to apologize to Tony Tebbe and Scott Dean, for the remarks about the pro staff stuff.
Both of these borads are full of folks with tons of knowledge and experiance. I hope that I will continue to be able to learn from all of them.
I cut my teath hunting predators with a lot of the information I learned on PM. I honed some of my skills with the information I have learned here on HM.
I would not be a call maker today if it were not for Rich Cronk and some of the others who posted so freely on PM in the past. So, I appologize to the folks on PM, and to the folks here on HM for stirring the pot.
Al Woodard
THO Game Calls
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The On Line Resource For Custom Call Makers
THO Game Calls
Posts: 266 | From: New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2005
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted July 24, 2006 10:12 AM
pup, you are welcome here, anytime. Scott doesn't scare anybody, he's a Teddy Bear in person.
Actually your last sentence contains the core issue, and that's as far as I'm going with it.
Good hunting. LB
edit: quote:
What is amazing is that most of us really get along well in person, unless I am mistaken or somebody is being a hypocrite.
[ July 24, 2006, 10:14 AM: Message edited by: Leonard ]
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted July 24, 2006 11:24 AM
ACC,
The easiest way for you to answer your own question about being an expert, is for you to simply hunt with them.
That will remove any and all doubt from your mind.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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Greenside
seems to know what he is talking about
Member # 10
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posted July 24, 2006 11:40 AM
quote:
Fuel for debate:
Maybe it’s just me, but I would think any person with connections to business and advertisers in the industry would be a good thing rather than some no-name individual making calls and beating on doors to solicit hopeful advertisers
Jay, Hopefully everyone will take this as constructive criticism?
It might matter on who's doors he'll be knocking?
When the connections and the alliances are in direct competition with the people you're trying to sell, I suspect it might get a little tougher.
I wonder what Minaska, JS, Burnham and some of the other electronic people think when they visit a site and see that half the moderators there are also moderators on the site trying to sell you advertising? Same might go for some call makers facing the same issues such a joint ventures etc.
O well, time will tell? Like I said, Hopefully just constructive cricticism. All business need to be very aware of "Appearence"
Posts: 719 | From: IA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Jay Nistetter
Legalize Weed, Free the Dixie Chicks
Member # 140
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posted July 24, 2006 12:00 PM
Should those in question have been banned?
Can't say. I don't know the whole story and wasn't privy to private emails or phone calls if any and to be quite frank, skimmed most of the posts anyway.
I will say that when I was involved in Posse Country, I was one of 2 voting NOT to ban Bill Martz. Bill stayed but we did manage to ban his daughter. LOL
[ July 24, 2006, 12:02 PM: Message edited by: Jay Nistetter ]
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Understanding the coyote is not as important as knowing where they are.
I usually let the fur prime up before I leave 'em lay.
Posts: 1006 | From: Arizona | Registered: Feb 2003
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ACC
Knows what it's all about
Member # 903
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posted July 24, 2006 01:05 PM
River Runner,
A few questions for you here since I can't get these figured out as well.
When you were at PM and saw the Hostile Mutany coming on, why did just fire these guys or just veto their vote. Is your position at PM as owner elected? Is this correct?
How are these guys acting greedy when it was Lynn and yourself want the magazine deal done with Lynn as the owner.
If Randy Black is half owner, is he one of the greedy ones as well?
Since these guys are already advertisers, they already have access to post/advertise on every forum on the board so why do they need control of the board?
How did Byron South and Redfrog manipulate all the rest of the 20 or so moderators, and why did you get no support for you magazine proposal?
Posts: 41 | From: It takes a whole lot of liquor to like her! | Registered: Jul 2006
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Cdog911
"There are some ideas so absurd only an intellectual could believe them."--George Orwell.
Member # 7
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posted July 24, 2006 01:23 PM
Jay, some interesting points, to be sure. But my read is that the issues surround the fact that so much energy is spent in promoting certain product lines over others and those outside the inner sanctum view that as either favoritism or specific individuals serving their own self interests in hopes of garnering a "Pro Staff" spot.
At the same time, maybe it would be more palatable if the person responsible for selling advertising wasn't so deeply vested in the board and oftentimes recognized and affiliated with a specific brand of calling product. That situation really makes it look like the brands we don't see are not seen for reasons other than the fact that they choose not to advertise as much. Maybe they aren't asked to.
In a way, this situation reminds me of a nameless editor that was offering himself up to all these different manufacturers in the name of advertising for his magazine. He'd play his pitch like each was the most important account for his career in an attempt to seduce them into a contract. This month, he'd do a feature article on their product, extolling its virtues like it as the best thing since women.
Then, a couple months later, in the next issue or a couple issues down the line (when he mistakenly presumed others would have forgotten his prior statements), he'd be courting another vendor with the same "this is the best thing going" article and telling the readers how this was the only product of this type that he has ever used (when the readers knew full well he was lying). Long story less long - it brought his credibility into question and ultimately, compromised the credibility of his magazine because readers and vendors, alike, saw these actions as conflicts of interest.
I can see the benefits of having a recognizable name doing your marketing, but maybe it would have been better if it was someone less directly involved in offering such a significant account thru that site. I feel bad that he is under personal attack here when, in truth, the issue is more the situation than the man.
But, one thing is for sure. Several separate issues have risen here telling us that the problem is more complex than just one or two people that do not get along.
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I am only one. But still, I am one. I cannot do everything, but still, I can do something; and, because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do something that I can do.
Posts: 5438 | From: The gun-lovin', gun-friendly wild, wild west | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted July 24, 2006 01:51 PM
There are actually two seperate issues here and since one brought the other to light they are being lumped together. The banning was seperate of all the issues with PM ownership and internal doings. As for the banning issue, my personal feeling is that it was unneccessary, and that will always be my reaction towards it. I have had no major open beef with anyone involved in the vote but have had a few minor disagreements on one topic or another, and I didn't know or care that it had affected their feelings toward me that much. If so, and they seen a chance to pull a little weight to get "even" then so be it. Since the banning, many more issues have been brought to light with some of the guys involved, and these issues for the most part had nothing to do with me, but some did involve mistreatment of guys that I like and respect, including Varmint Hunter and River Runner to name a couple. So my opinion of some of the people involved has dropped considerably, but wether or not I personally like them will have little to do with their overall successes or failures in life.
ACC, I'm not sure where all the terminolgy comes from. I don't consider myself as one of the "elite" and have spent enough time in Rich and Vics jockstraps to figure out that they really don't promote themselves that way either. They are just good guys that are also capable coyote callers. There are all kinds of knowledgeable guys around here, some on guns, some on night hunting, some on rockets, hell, pick a subject. But nobody here promotes themselves as experts or expert teachers. I have got to spend alot of time with guys that I do consider the "elite" and I am just plain lucky in that matter. Most of the guys I put in that group have never made a post on any of the boards involved, except for Scott Huber who used to post some, but rarely does anymore, and Les Johnson who posts occasionally. The others have remained anonymous to the internet world and probably always will. I'm just fortunate to have got to spend some time with them and learn a little, and occasionally when someone has a question, I remember the answer from something someone else taught me, and can answer it correctly. I have also put a little of that knowledge to use and do occasionally kill a coyote. Hope that clears a little water for you. Don't lump me with the experts, I'm just the guy that told them where to fly the black helicopter. That may become my new sig line!
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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Locohead
World Famous Smoke Dancer
Member # 15
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posted July 24, 2006 01:53 PM
Hey, does anyone here have a really great jackrabbit recipe?!?!
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I love my critters and chick!!!! :)
Posts: 2219 | From: CO | Registered: Jan 2003
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ACC
Knows what it's all about
Member # 903
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posted July 24, 2006 02:28 PM
Cal Taylor,
The post are flying around that PM has lost all its talented members so I am wondering how a person gets that rep?
Posts: 41 | From: It takes a whole lot of liquor to like her! | Registered: Jul 2006
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varmit hunter
Knows what it's all about
Member # 37
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posted July 24, 2006 02:37 PM
Danny. Jackrabbits are snap. Get a green 2' X 4" board Oak is best. Cut it the same length as the Jack. Add plenty of potatoes, celery.garlic,carrots and of course peppers. Place ingredients in pressure cooker for 82 hours and 15 minutes. Remove lid a rabidly pull out Jack and throw it to the Dogs. Then dig in. Bone appetite.
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Make them pay for the wind.
Posts: 932 | From: Orange,TX | Registered: Jan 2003
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Cal Taylor
Knows what it's all about
Member # 199
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posted July 24, 2006 02:50 PM
I guess I'm not sure ACC. I can't post there, so it must not be self inflicted.
How do I Google you?
Maybe it's because sometimes I call them in really close?
[ July 24, 2006, 02:59 PM: Message edited by: Cal Taylor ]
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.
FoxPro Field Staff Member
Posts: 1069 | From: Wyoming | Registered: May 2003
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted July 24, 2006 03:04 PM
ACC, you know that Cal has just disavowed the title of "expert" and I remind you that he was not the one using that verbage, in the first place.
I could be completely wrong, but I'm beginning to wonder about your motivation. I know of know one that has recently registered on PM to demand answers that was not there, before.
On the other hand, you seem to have shown up with an agenda. That's my take on what I see and read.
Now, I want you to know that you are welcome to post here. I will not ban, delete or edit anything you say or have on your mind, but I think it is obvious that you are a little hostile and sympathetic toward the PM point of view.
Also, I want you to understand that I will not lock the thread, or ask for a poll on whether it should be locked....all the while reminding everybody that I have the power to do it without concensus, as did MM. Do you understand that little distinction, between here and there?
Good hunting. LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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ACC
Knows what it's all about
Member # 903
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posted July 24, 2006 03:08 PM
Yes I understand the distinction between here and there. I do have an agenda. To find out the answers that have been on my mind for a while, and the people with the answers are here not there.
Posts: 41 | From: It takes a whole lot of liquor to like her! | Registered: Jul 2006
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Leonard
HMFIC
Member # 2
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posted July 24, 2006 03:38 PM
I have just received an email from Michael McCasland.
This is a public apology and a retraction of anything negative I have said about him. I actually, always liked him, and remember ribbing him at the Tom Mix Hunt about how similiar our Al Lux calls were, but mine was autographed! He alone made breakfast for everybody. And his partner, Bill Rice is a virtual expert, good guy and the luckiest man to hold a raffle ticket, that I have ever seen!
Michael, I won't edit my remarks, but I retract them in the interest of fairness and I'm sorry that I offended you. I would enjoy hunting with you. If (ever) I should be down your way, I have my own ladder.
Sincerely, LB
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EL BEE Knows It All and Done It All.
Don't piss me off!
Posts: 31465 | From: Upland, CA | Registered: Jan 2003
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Michael J.
PAKMAN
Member # 905
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posted July 24, 2006 03:58 PM
Yes, I've been looking in on all this as has about everyone else it seems. Believe it or not I like most everyone here on this board. I know the feeling isn't mutual, it doesn't have to be. We all have our point of view.
Thank You Leonard, I appreciate it. No editing necessary, I know how it can be.
Edit: by the way I was trying to show that the membership really was making the decision to keep the thread open or close it. The topic had pretty much run it's course, it was time for us to move on. But I fully understand the need to keep going here, please don't read into this that I am hinting that you guys should stop the discussion, I really dropped in to thank Leonard and that was about all.
[ July 24, 2006, 04:07 PM: Message edited by: Michael J. ]
Posts: 5 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jul 2006
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NASA
Knows what it's all about
Member # 177
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posted July 24, 2006 04:02 PM
quote:
The post are flying around that PM has lost all its talented members so I am wondering how a person gets that rep?
There are several ways: Self-promotion, corporate promotion, virtual fabrication, and the old fashioned way. Earn it.
Posts: 1168 | From: Typical White Person | Registered: Apr 2003
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NASA
Knows what it's all about
Member # 177
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posted July 24, 2006 04:06 PM
Hi, McC. Does this mean you're going to start getting out more often? ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posts: 1168 | From: Typical White Person | Registered: Apr 2003
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Michael J.
PAKMAN
Member # 905
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posted July 24, 2006 04:09 PM
You know that I rarely travel from board to board and this isn't the first time I've posted over here. It looks like it though, I forgot my password and re registered, I know it's bad to do that, I shouldn't have, but hey I just wanted totalk a little.
Posts: 5 | From: Arizona | Registered: Jul 2006
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NASA
Knows what it's all about
Member # 177
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posted July 24, 2006 04:14 PM
It's still good to see you, wherever you show up. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Posts: 1168 | From: Typical White Person | Registered: Apr 2003
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Bill
Knows what it's all about
Member # 49
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posted July 24, 2006 04:52 PM
Leonard thank you for the kind words, I will take exception to any reference to expert. However…. Coincidence being what it is, the big game hunters have been anxiously awaiting the results of the Arizona Big Game drawing and I accessed them moments ago. I was lucky enough to draw my first choices for deer and ANTELOPE!!! After nearly 30 years of reapplying and 12 bonus points I finally got another antelope tag. I’m truly a happy man.
Posts: 55 | From: Tucson | Registered: Jan 2003
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Tim Behle
Administrator MacNeal Sector
Member # 209
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posted July 24, 2006 05:25 PM
Bill,
You lucky dog!
I got another Mule deer and Javelina tag. Missed again on the Antelope. Tried for Elk and Big horn sheep for the first time, no surprise to not get drawn for them.
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Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too young to die and too old to take
an ass kickin'.
Posts: 3160 | From: Five Miles East of Vic, AZ | Registered: Jun 2003
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csmithers
unknown comic
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posted July 24, 2006 05:28 PM
the one thing that separates the pros from the rest of us is that they have and encourage stalkers.
i was a member here for nearly a year before making my first post. i like to think i know a thing or two about predator hunting. then you hang around here for a little bit and realize there's a lot left to learn. even the pro's are thrown curve balls now and then. they learn to adapt and overcome to get the results. i go and sit in the truck, sulk for a bit and then blame it on my gun!
[ July 24, 2006, 05:36 PM: Message edited by: smithers ]
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George Ackley
Knows what it's all about
Member # 898
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posted July 24, 2006 05:43 PM
quote:
Hey, does anyone here have a really great jackrabbit recipe?!?!
YEP 22MAG cci stinger to the Cranium
Posts: 465 | From: PHILA . PA | Registered: Jul 2006
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