This is topic C abela's---- Anti trapping??? in forum Member forum at The New Huntmastersbbs!.
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Posted by Cal Taylor (Member # 199) on May 26, 2005, 06:25 AM:
Here's something for you guys to ponder.
As most of you know we have a new video coming out. It is calling summertime coyotes using decoy dogs and most of it was filmed while actually doing control work. I filmed some stuff with another local county trapper and in one segment we showed some livestock kills and he explained that these particular coyotes had been hard to call and decoy because that particular rancher was using guard dogs, so he had set some traps and cleaned them up. We showed a coyote in a trap. This coyote was completely docile in the trap. We didn't show him hitting the end of the chain or any kind of a struggle, and we didn't show the trapper killing the coyote either. Anyway we have sent out a few preliminary copies to various vendors, and the reply from Cabela's was that they would only take the video if we removed the trapped coyote from the video. So of course the trapped coyote is out, because of sales concerns, but the more I think about it the madder I get.
Posted by varmit hunter (Member # 37) on May 26, 2005, 07:23 AM:
Cal. This is sickening. They are forcing us to abandon a great American heritage through our own pocket books.
I understand you had to remove it are loose a years work. America did not mind when only the trappers would go out west and suffer the consequences, and dangers of a unknown land. It was the trappers that discovered the routs,and passes so the west could be settled.
Now all the Hollywood types live on the mountain tops and decry everything about trapping. Trapping is dear to my heart and I could rave on about this for days. There are many catalogs in my pile. Now the stack will be just a little shorter.
Ronnie
Edited for over reaction.
[ May 26, 2005, 07:26 AM: Message edited by: varmit hunter ]
Posted by Andy L (Member # 642) on May 26, 2005, 07:34 AM:
Cabelas has done a couple of things lately that piss me off. This being the latest.
I would guess the days of hunting videos, period, are probably numbered. Its just a shame that a "sportsmans outlet", would succumb to that mentality.
Give and inch, they take a mile.
Sorry to hear that Cal.
Andy
Posted by Jay Nistetter (Member # 140) on May 26, 2005, 08:19 AM:
It does seem somewhat odd given the reality of all other facits of hunting they and other sporting goods stores cater too.
Will a Director's Cut be available?
Posted by NASA (Member # 177) on May 26, 2005, 10:53 AM:
Jay, you beat me to the punch. That's exactly the question I was going to ask. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posted by Greenside (Member # 10) on May 26, 2005, 11:57 AM:
That doesn't make alot of sense. I could understand why they wouldn't want to carry alot of trapper supply items, expecially the lures and the baits, but refuse to sell a video with a short clip of a trapped coyote? Jeez, they even sell TP&C in their book and library departments.
Dennis
Posted by Cal Taylor (Member # 199) on May 26, 2005, 12:16 PM:
No, sorry guys, no directors cut. It seems that to get these copies made it is more expensive to do it with two different videos. There will just be one. I have an original or two, and I sent a few out. Rich Cronk has one, Scott Huber, Rob Meyers, so I guess that makes theirs collectors items.
Posted by DAA (Member # 11) on May 26, 2005, 12:39 PM:
Sheesh... If they are going to make you remove a mild scene like that, I guess I shouldn't feel so bad. Cabela's never responded to me at all ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
. Sportsman's Warehouse declined to carry my videos, said they were too graphic, and too much killing. That was probably a blessing in disguise, really, as I'm not at all sure I want anymore locals knowing about me. I get too many emails every week asking me where to hunt already.
- DAA
Posted by Jay Nistetter (Member # 140) on May 26, 2005, 12:54 PM:
DAA
I am curious. What was your reaction to Gary over at SW? I guess I just got off on the wrong foot.
Posted by DAA (Member # 11) on May 26, 2005, 01:38 PM:
Jay, it's been long enough, I really can't remember exactly how I responded (it was on the phone). But my response was probably a standard, courteous, business-speak version of "Thanks, have a nice day and eff you too".
- DAA
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 26, 2005, 02:27 PM:
Dave, I looked at your site, an hour ago. Nice pictures, good articles on load development, and a nice recomendation for HM. Thank you.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by 2dogs (Member # 649) on May 26, 2005, 02:32 PM:
IMO, Killin, is killin. Whether it be by gun, trap, posion, or ran over by a tank, ect, ect. It's interesting how some people who have stuffed animals or sell guns or traps or whatever. Draw the line on something such as what you guys are talking about.
Reminds me of a guy, I once knew. Went by the name; Joe Goody-two-shoes...Ya heard of'em?
Please excuse me now, I want to vommit.
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 26, 2005, 03:24 PM:
I think, in most cases, we have the responsiblity of dispatching an animal as quickly and as humanely as possible. Therefore, there are a few methods that I personally do not approve of; as a sportsman. Baited hooks come to mind, for instance. I also oppose air gunning on public land. That might be a hot button topic, but I think it is unjustified. I'd rather see them shoot mustangs and burros.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Locohead (Member # 15) on May 26, 2005, 03:37 PM:
That is really too bad Cal.
I've got a friend that lives up in the forest near Clark for a couple of months every summer. How far away it that from you? He caught an 8 lb. trout up there last year.
Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on May 26, 2005, 04:10 PM:
OK Leonard, just remember, you started it.
Here is my opinion of aerial Gunning and Wildlife services.
They should not be allowed on public land, that the general public is not allowed access to.
Ranchers who will not allow public access should be charged the full, actual costs for government trappers and aerial gunners.
I see no reason to share my tax dollars with someone too stingy to share access to public lands.
Posted by Doggitter (Member # 489) on May 26, 2005, 06:08 PM:
That's really good news Cal. NOT! :>( I just emailed them and am curious what the reply will be.
"I would like to know just where your company's stand is on the sport/way of living of trapping. I was just reading the posts on a favorite hunting BB and Cal Taylor said that he has a new coyote video out and upon talking to Cabelas, it was rejected for consideration of sale due to a scene showing a coyote in a trap. What is the story? Are you seriously willing to alienate this huge segment of the population and possibly a tremnedous amout of people that will jump on the same wagon? I'd like an official answer to this very important topic. Thank you, Loren P. Coffin."
Complete with typos too...
[ May 26, 2005, 06:09 PM: Message edited by: Doggitter ]
Posted by Leonard (Member # 2) on May 26, 2005, 06:23 PM:
And, you know what, Loren? They will claim that they get a lot more complaints from animal lovers. The problem with that is.....they are not the customers that buy Cabella's stuff.
Good hunting. LB
Posted by Melvin (Member # 634) on May 26, 2005, 07:06 PM:
I wanted to give my thoughts on this,but i'm to damned boiling mad right at the moment ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
Posted by Cal Taylor (Member # 199) on May 26, 2005, 07:09 PM:
I'm not sure what their reply will be either Doggitter. I'm sure they are overloaded with videos wanting in and be as critical as they choose. I know John Graham has had no luck getting his trapping videos in there, and they are very high quality, so I assume it is a trapping deal all the way around. But I would appreciate not getting on them too much until they at least carry the video, LOL! They might give us the boot before we get in the door. The name of the video is "Going to the Dogs".
As for you guys and aerial gunning. You need to remember that its not only to benefit ranchers, but alot is done for wildlife, and yes some of that wildlife is in inaccessable areas, but there is alot of spill over. If not for some control our deer and antelope here would be wiped out. States like Utah, Nevada, and Wyoming are at all time lows for sheep production and most of the stuff the Feds are doing is for wildlife, not livestock. Our county programs (not federal)here are ran by collecting a head tax from livestock producers. For every head of livestock they sell 50 cents to a dollar is held out for predator control, and that is the major funding of our programs, so they are paying for alot of the air time here. And when the programs are low on funding and they want the plane they pay for it completely out of their own pockets. So at least for Wyoming, alot of the money designated for livestock protection comes out of the ranchers own pockets. And that still helps wildlife. You guys know as well as I do that recreational calling and trapping will not begin to control populations since the demise of 1080. That was the last time that there was any true contol of coyote populations. As it is now we can all hunt as hard as we want and the populations will still increase. Or at least that is my opinion.
[ May 26, 2005, 07:14 PM: Message edited by: Cal Taylor ]
Posted by Doggitter (Member # 489) on May 26, 2005, 09:23 PM:
Never mind...:>)
On second thought.. I'm sorry if I used your name when I shouldn't have. I know, I'm slow. Didn't occur to me until I posted here. :>(
[ May 26, 2005, 09:27 PM: Message edited by: Doggitter ]
Posted by RanUtah (Member # 18) on May 27, 2005, 03:46 PM:
Thats a real bummer Cal. I have a copy of Cal's video and don't see a problem with the trapped coyote in the scene. I bet a hundred dollar bill that theres other videos that they do carry that has far worse. This dosen't even compare. WTH? The coyote is just laying there and appears to be in no pain what so ever. I just wonder who reviews the videos anyway. Is it just more than one person, a committee or what? Arrgh... The more I think about it..............
Posted by Tim Behle (Member # 209) on May 27, 2005, 06:38 PM:
Jay,
Wasn't it Cabela's that you had problems with, when you published your book?
Posted by Melvin (Member # 634) on May 27, 2005, 06:45 PM:
Cal, its a damn shame you had to give into these people,but a man got to make a living. We that trap are a minority bunch in the sporting world and we take more of a beating than any other sportsman, we can see no end to it. I think back when a youngster would catch a mink,muskrat or a small fur bearing animal and see that proud look on his face for catching his first animal. Today if that young guy would make an anouncement in school that he caught his first fur,they probably would expell him for a few days...this makes me hot,very hot and where will it end? Damn world is full of a** h****...By the way,they will never get a dime of my money.
[ May 27, 2005, 07:20 PM: Message edited by: Melvin ]
Posted by Doggitter (Member # 489) on May 31, 2005, 06:13 PM:
Here's the only response I've gotten back from Cabela's on the video.
Loren,
I read your question below. I am the buyer for the video category. There
is no stance in my video selection that in anyway is against trapping. I
have added many varmint hunting videos and have had good luck with most.
This seems to be a growing market and I think that it is great. I grew
up running trap lines for coyotes in western Nebraska, and fully
understand the need to keep their numbers at bay. If the video that you
mentioned below was rejected it definitely was not on a anti-trapping
bases. Thanks for your support.
Eric Wieser
Product Manager
(308) 254-5505
Nice of our freind Eric to explain exactly why this happened in the first place. Ha!
Posted by Jay Nistetter (Member # 140) on May 31, 2005, 09:06 PM:
Not really Tim.
Totally different.
Posted by Lungbuster (Member # 630) on May 31, 2005, 10:12 PM:
Cal,
Please excuse me for being a "dumb ass back East".
But what is 1080?
Posted by Doggitter (Member # 489) on May 31, 2005, 10:36 PM:
a very effective poison.
Posted by Rob (Member # 75) on June 01, 2005, 02:37 PM:
1080 was developed by the U.S. armed forces as a rodenticide against rats in Burma,
China, and Indochina. Chemically known as sodium monofluroacetate, 1080 was so
named because it was the one-thousand-eightieth in a series of formula modifications that
the U.S Fish and Wildlife Service had tried in readapting the compound for use as a
predator control agent. In practice, preparation of a 1080 bait station usually involved
shooting an old or wild horse, mule or burro. Just before killing the station animal, a
Morton Meat Gun containing 1080 was readied. As the animal fell, it was deeply injected
in several places while the carcass was still at normal body temperature. Capillary action
circulated the lethal compound throught the meat. If proper techniques were followed, all
segments of the treated carcass were fatal to canines. Portions of the carcass, well
anchored to avoid scattering, were then distributed on a selected canine run.
Posted by Lonny (Member # 19) on June 01, 2005, 04:38 PM:
My Dad has told me about when 1080 was used in this area. Ranchers would donate an old work horse and a government guy would inject the meat as Rob described. Everyone in the area was told to keep their stock dogs tied up for a few days if they wanted to keep them alive. Dad said Ol'Shep snuck underneath the jeep pickup the meat was loaded on and snuck a couple of licks before anyone saw him. A couple of licks of 1080 laced meat was all it took to kill Ol'Shep several hours later. From the description the stuff is damn lethal and has far reaching effects. Even magpies that picked at what a coyote barfed out would be dead on the spot.
They used 1080 in the chicken house to control rats. After one use they didn't have a rat problem for years afterward.
One old rancher who lived to be damn near 100 years old was so impressed with the stuff he got the Idaho license plate "I 1080". He had that plate for many years until he died a few years ago.
Posted by Barndog (Member # 255) on June 02, 2005, 02:00 PM:
Welcome to the new World. Cabalas wants to see more stuff like this. http://www.aphis.usda.gov/ws/nwrc/research/predation/index.html
Posted by Melvin (Member # 634) on June 02, 2005, 09:01 PM:
Barndog,I know where they can shove that at to! Up there ***,If they got one?
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